Garret Ahearn (Fine Gael)
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I thank the Minister of State for coming to the House today. First, it is important to acknowledge the work done by the Department of Social Protection in issuing PPS numbers, in particular in the last year when 300,000 were issued. The Department has done so speedily, particularly for Ukrainian citizens coming to Ireland. This Commencement matter has a lot to do with retail and hospitality, so I am glad this Minister of State is taking it. From my experience, and from queries received in my office, there are a lot of businesses in Clonmel, County Tipperary, which are looking to employ people. We are fortunate at the moment that there are 2.6 million people working in Ireland. We have a challenge getting people from outside Ireland to come here and fill the jobs that are vacant. The Minister of State will know, as it is under his remit, that last year almost 40,000 people arrived in Ireland from outside of the EU having successfully applied for work permits.

A lot of the time businesses are applying for work permits on behalf of the individual. Those work permits are being processed much quicker now than they were one year to 18 months ago. This is hugely welcome. The Minister of State's Department is doing fantastic work on that front. Once they receive their work permit, they have to apply for a visa, which still takes quite some time. That needs to become quicker. We now have a third issue, about which I am receiving a large number of queries from businesses, which is simply getting the PPS number afterwards. A lot of these people are coming from outside of the EU, in particular from Asia. Businesses are putting a lot of money into getting work permits done, and to get people over as quickly as possible. You think you are over all of the hoops once you have gone through work permits and visas only to find out you are waiting a long time for a PPS number. Obviously, people cannot work in that time. They cannot open a bank account.

People who are meant to be starting work in hospitality in Tipperary have been waiting three months for a PPS number. There is someone else who is waiting to work in a retail grocery store. They have been waiting eight weeks for their PPS number. It can be incredibly frustrating, particularly for employers who are trying to get staff at a time where that is a real challenge. They have jumped through all the hoops, which were difficult, to now find that something else is really delayed.

I accept the demand has been huge. In fairness to the Minister of State and the Department, they have put more resources into speeding up the times to process PPS numbers. I suspect that when looked at as a whole, the time is quite quick. However, I would like to know the average times, and then maybe the average times for those other than Ukrainian citizens. The Department has put more resources into it, and the Minister has highlighted the priority to ensure quick turnaround times. On the ground, from what I have heard from employers, things seem to be going in the opposite direction. My concern is that we do not reach a stage where the Minister of State and his Department have solved the delays with work permits, but we are struggling to get people working because of something as simple as getting a PPS number.

Neale Richmond (Dublin Rathdown, Fine Gael)
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I am pleased to take this Commencement matter on behalf of my senior colleague in the Department of Social Protection, Deputy Heather Humphreys. As the Senator knows, to apply for a PPSN an adult must generally provide valid proof of identity, address and reason for applying. The easiest way to apply for a PPSN is online at mywelfare.ie.

To directly answer the Senator's question, as of 28 May 2023 the national wait time for PPSN allocation using mywelfare.ieis 1.3 weeks. While the PPSN application process is relatively straightforward, delays can occur on individual applications where incomplete applications are submitted, or there are problems with the quality of documents provided. When this occurs, the applicant is contacted by officials from the Department of Social Protection to help progress their application. In addition, the Department of Social Protection has arrangements in place with other public bodies, employer groups and representative bodies to expedite applications in cases of urgency. Where people arrive in the country and are granted temporary protection having fled the war in Ukraine, or seek international protection, a priority for the Department of Social Protection is the quick allocation of a PPS number to these individuals. To achieve this, the Department has put in place special arrangements to deal with PPS number applications for people seeking temporary protection. A reception centre is in operation at City West convention centre where Department of Social Protection, Department of Justice and Department of Children, Equality, Disability, Integration and Youth officials are available to meet people on arrival from Ukraine. The information needed to allocate a PPS number is collected as part of the initial engagement with the person there, and the PPS number is available for them to collect at any Intreo centre across the country within four working days.

Applications for PPS numbers are also being processed quickly for people who arrive in the country and seek international protection. To achieve this officials from the Department of Social Protection have colocated with Department of Justice international protection staff in Mount Street since 25 January 2023. People seeking international protection attend at Mount Street to submit their international protection applications when they arrive in the country. They can meet with Department of Social Protection officials on the same day in Mount Street to make an application for a PPS number. The application will be processed within four working days and can be collected by the person at any Intreo centre across the country. The timeframe for the allocation of PPS numbers is the same for temporary protection and international protection applicants. There are no delays in allocating PPS numbers to either temporary protection or international protection applicants.

The Senator raised an interesting comparison concerning the average waiting time for work permits, which as of last week has come down to about 16 days from a high of 21 weeks. This is due to a lot of work not just by officials from the Department of Enterprise Trade and Employment, but crucially under the previous Minister of State, Deputy Damien English, in this role. I fully accept the point that there is often a much longer wait for visas. However, going forward in the medium term, the Department is working with the Department of Justice to develop a new singular portal. This will enable a person to apply for a work permit and a visa in one application, and receive a single response within an acceptable time. This will go a long way in speeding things up.

On the Senator's direct plea on PPS numbers, there are always individual cases and circumstances. It is hard to refer to them as a general case, because as the Senator has pointed out the system is working efficiently on average. If there are individual cases the Senator would like to bring to me, as Minister of State at the Department of Social Protection, I would be more than happy to work with him to expedite them where possible.

Garret Ahearn (Fine Gael)
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I thank the Minister of State for that offer. I might take him up on that. I have a number of cases in Clonmel, in particular, that I need to get through as quickly as possible. I understand the turnaround time is 1.3 weeks. Is it possible to get a breakdown of what it is per county for Tipperary? It is definitely not what I am experiencing. Another question, which is important, is whether that average turnaround time includes Ukrainian citizens who arrived in the past year. Their turnaround time is four days. If you take between 80,000 and 100,000 Ukrainians who have come into the country, that is 100,000 from the 300,000 where the average turnaround is four days. That means that for people who are not Ukrainians, the average time is much higher than the 1.3 weeks.

I want to find about the crux of the average time, which I hope the Department can help me with. What is the average turnaround time for people who went for work permits, visas and then applied for PPS numbers? What is the average time just for the PPS number? That is the issue I am having. It is not with Ukrainians, Irish citizens and newborns. Everything is on time, except for people who are coming here from outside of Europe, applying for a work permit and then for a visa and waiting a long time for a PPS number.

I welcome the fact the Minister of State and the Department are looking to streamline the work permits and visas going forward. The work done already in speeding up the issuing of work permits has been really impressive. To align that with the visa application is important.

Neale Richmond (Dublin Rathdown, Fine Gael)
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I want to conclude by giving the Senator a sense of the scale of the PPSN operation in the Department of Social Protection. In 2022, more than 236,000 PPSNs were allocated. Between January and April this year alone, more than 67,000 PPSNs have been allocated. These figures do not include the PPSNs automatically allocated when a child's birth is registered. As I mentioned, that is 67,000 adults with an average wait time of 1.3 weeks.I do not have a breakdown per county. It should be remembered that the whole idea is do these through an online portal rather than through individual Intreo offices. This approach is enabling efficiencies and speeding up the process. The reason the average wait time is so low is that the Department has ensured cases were prioritised where there was an urgent need to obtain a PPSN. It has also massively increased capacity.

The Senator provided good examples of representations he has received in County Tipperary. As I said, they may be out of kilter with the national norm due to the specific nature of the country from which the person comes. It is crucial that all documents are up to spec to ensure the process operates quickly. I reiterate my offer to assist the Senator wherever I can going forward.

Victor Boyhan (Independent)
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I welcome the students from Balla National School in County Mayo. We have just concluded Commencement matters, which are topics that are chosen every day for discussion in the Seanad, usually as the first business. On my left, is the Minister of State, Deputy Richmond, who responded to the Commencement matters and seated in front of me is Senator Garret Ahearn from County Tipperary. The students came in at the tail end of the discussion. They are very welcome and I hope they enjoy their visit to the Oireachtas.