Seán Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, Ceann Comhairle)
Link to this: Individually | In context

I remind Members that we have seven minutes per question broken down as follows: two minutes for the Members asking questions, three minutes for the reply and one minute each for a supplementary question and answer.

Micheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context

In light of the fact that the Moriarty tribunal has issued a report concerning the awarding of the most valuable commercial licence ever awarded by an Irish Government - and accepting and acknowledging the report is detailed and complex and this is no small issue, which has enormous implications for the State, both financial and political - and that it represents a damning indictment of the collective decision arrived at by the then Government and the process leading to the decision to award the licence, the report addresses two core points: what happened before the licence was awarded to promote the interests of one bidder and what happened after the licence was awarded.

Even though it is a long and detailed report, in the context of issues about which the Taoiseach will be aware, will he explain his own personal level of knowledge of the pervasive culture at the time of Esat Digifone raising its level of influence within Fine Gael and over Fine Gael via the many donations it made at the time? A strong link is made in the report between what is termed "a pattern of significant conspicuous financial support to Fine Gael" and the decision arrived at regarding the awarding of the licence. Would the Taoiseach be able to explain his own personal level of knowledge of that culture and of the fundraising activities that went on?

Six members of the current Government sat around the Cabinet table when that most valuable licence was awarded. Will the Taoiseach, in light of his earlier commitment, facilitate an opportunity to the House and to those Ministers to account for their role in that decision and their perspective on how that licence was awarded?

Does the Government intend to send the report to the Director of Public Prosecutions?

Enda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context

I note the Deputy's statement that this, in his view, is a damning indictment of the collective decision arrived at by the Government of the day. I have not had an opportunity to glance through the report or to hold the 2,000 page offering in my hands yet. However, I am glad it has been published. I asked from the Deputy's seat on many occasions over the past number of years when it would be published and I welcome its publication. This is a serious report and it deserves serious consideration. Ample opportunity will be given in due course to debate it in this Chamber. I do not want to say anything now because I have not read the report but, after 14 years, it deserves serious consideration.

Obviously, the report refers to the Civil Service, politicians and the processes by which Government decisions are arrived at and by which Government does its business. All Members are probably constrained to an extent by the fact there are at least four, if not six, cases pending before both the High Court and the Supreme Court in respect of this report. The Deputy can take it that the lessons to be learned from this report will be learned. I have already replied to the Deputy in respect of making a contribution on this issue in the House. The Minister for Communications, Energy and Natural Resources will take a private notice question after Leaders' questions. It is a serious report that deserves serious consideration and I intend to give it that.

Micheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context

Am I to understand that the Taoiseach will not be here for the private notice question and that it is just for the Minister for Communications, Energy and Natural Resources?

Enda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context

The private notice question is to the Minister for Communications, Energy and Natural Resources. Obviously, I will be here before the-----

Micheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context

But the Taoiseach will not be answering questions today on it.

Enda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context

No. The question is tabled to the Minister.

Micheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context

The Taoiseach should be under no illusions that this decision and the findings of this report do enormous reputational damage to the country in terms of the way it does its business. In respect of many of the issues in the report the Taoiseach does not need to read some aspects of it.

Micheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context

I refer to the Telenor donation. There is a damning conclusion from the chairman of the tribunal regarding the Taoiseach's party's lack of co-operation and concealment, and the decision not to give the details of that donation to the tribunal. It is a stinging criticism of Fine Gael and is by far the most serious criticism of a political party made in any report of a tribunal of inquiry established by this House. It states: "Whilst allowance is made for the factors mentioned at 3.3.1, this observation nonetheless is seen as applying to Fine Gael, whose role both in Government and Opposition had been instrumental in the establishment of this Tribunal, in favour of which establishment-----

Seán Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, Ceann Comhairle)
Link to this: Individually | In context

Thank you, Deputy.

Micheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context

-----its Oireachtas members had unanimously voted". It states that without media disclosures in 2001, "No person or entity connected with the payment [this is the payment from Esat of $50,000] saw fit to notify the tribunal of it, notwithstanding a substantial degree of knowledge of its clandestine circumstances and proffered return, and it is likely that, without the media disclosures that occurred in 2001, the matter would have remained hidden from public knowledge".

The Taoiseach has come in here and said that he has read nothing of that and that he knows nothing of the detail to get him over today but I am under no illusions that the Taoiseach has been well briefed, even by now, in terms of the essence of this report and the conclusions. I say to the Taoiseach-----

Seán Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, Ceann Comhairle)
Link to this: Individually | In context

The Deputy has gone over his time. The Taoiseach to reply.

Micheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context

In the first instance the Taoiseach should account for that reference to the absolute lack of co-operation by his party. Does he, on behalf of his party, apologise for that fundamental lack of co-operation with the tribunal on that specific issue alone, which he does not need to read about because he knows all about it?

Enda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context

I do not agree at all with the Deputy that this is about getting over today. There are many tomorrows when there will be an opportunity to discuss this report. I have already answered a question from the Deputy when he asked if I would contribute to this debate, and I said I would do so.

Micheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context

No, I did not ask you that.

Enda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context

Yes, you did.

Micheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context

I asked you to answer questions, not-----

Seán Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, Ceann Comhairle)
Link to this: Individually | In context

Through the Chair, please.

Enda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context

Yes, and I will answer questions in so far as I can. The Deputy said it is not necessary to read the report. The Deputy's former leader did not read the Lisbon treaty. It is necessary to read reports. In fact, if the Deputy goes back a little further he will recall that he himself decided not to read a particular brief, which cost €400 million as an issue.

Dara Calleary (Mayo, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context

It cost a lot more-----

Enda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context

I remind the Deputy also that he said he had no responsibility for it.

Micheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context

Stick to the point.

Brian Hayes (Dublin South West, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context

That is the point.

Enda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context

It is important to read these reports.

In respect of an incident the Deputy mentioned earlier, I recall that the Fine Gael Party was commended by the tribunal for its forthrightness in bringing that to the notice of the tribunal.

Micheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context

That confirms you have not read it.

Enda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context

I like to read these reports. This is a serious report, as the Deputy said, and as I informed him there are between four or six either High Court or Supreme Court cases pending on this issue. Obviously, that will not prevent comment and the opportunity for a proper discourse and debate here in the House about this issue. As I said, it does refer to politicians, the Civil Service and the processes of Government. It is clear that these are issues of which serious note must be taken and acted upon, and that will be done.

Gerry Adams (Louth, Sinn Fein)
Link to this: Individually | In context

Nuair a bhí muid ag caint agus ag magadh níos luaithe, dúirt mé leis an Taoiseach go raibh a lán fadhbanna romhainn, mar shampla, tuairisc Moriarty. Tá seans ann go mbeidh an Taoiseach ag labhairt faoin obair dáiríre thábhachtach sin. I appreciate the Taoiseach will not have had the chance to read the full report but I have scanned the executive summary and it is a clear exposé of a Fine Gael Minister for Communications and of a Fine Gael Government of which the Taoiseach and five other current Ministers were a part. I am not suggesting that he was in any way involved in anything inappropriate but Cabinet responsibility arises in respect of these matters. The then Minister, Deputy Lowry, is accused of providing substantive information to Denis O'Brien which was "of significant value and assistance to him securing the licence", that is, the mobile phone licence. Rinne an t-Uasal Lowry é sin gan aon cáineadh ó Thaoiseach Fhine Gael ag an uair. The report states that Fine Gael benefited to the tune of $50,000 from the Minister's "profoundly corrupt behaviour". That money was handed over in the United States of America.

There is a question about whether that money was declared at that time to the US Department of Justice. I understand that Fine Gael gave back the $50,000, eventually. I note Repsol press. Where are you, Eamon?

Seán Barrett (Dún Laoghaire, Ceann Comhairle)
Link to this: Individually | In context

Deputy Adams, please.

Gerry Adams (Louth, Sinn Fein)
Link to this: Individually | In context

Obviously, Fine Gael knew there was something inappropriate about this transaction and therefore what did it do at the time about it? Has Fine Gael received any other money from Denis O'Brien or any of his companies? There is a mention in the report of a total of IR£22,000 during the period under investigation. When will the Taoiseach make a full statement and when will the Dáil have the chance to discuss these issues fully?

Enda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context

Tá a fhios agamsa agus ag an Teachta Adams go bhfuil fadhbanna agus deacrachtaí móra le réitiú ag an tír agus ag muintir na hÉireann. Deputy Michael Lowry was appointed as a Minister in the Fine Gael-Labour-Democratic Left Government of 1994-97. When it became clear that there was an issue, the former Minister, Deputy Lowry, was removed forthwith. This party, in negotiating with the Labour Party for the formation of this Government, did not seek any support from Deputy Lowry.

Billy Kelleher (Cork North Central, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context

That is a different issue.

Micheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context

In fact, that is a different issue-----

Enda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context

I already dealt with the issue Deputy Martin raised about moneys that were allegedly to the benefit of Fine Gael. That matter was cleared up before the tribunal, and I will do so again whenever the discussion takes place here. The Whips can arrange that at an appropriate time.

The Deputy mentioned $50,000. I recall somebody sitting at this chair making a claim that the party the Deputy represents was in receipt of moneys way beyond that figure, which the Deputy denied, but in so far as this report is concerned, I want to study it. The Government will respond to it. The House will have an opportunity to discuss it and give its views. I repeat that there are lessons to be learned. Serious comments are made in the report about the Civil Service, politicians and the way Government processes work.

Micheál Martin (Cork South Central, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context

And about Fine Gael.

Enda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context

Yes, and the Deputy can take it from me that lessons, in so far as they can be learned, will be learned. It is only right and proper that having waited 13 years for this report it deserves serious analysis, which it will get.

Gerry Adams (Louth, Sinn Fein)
Link to this: Individually | In context

It took €150 million and 13 or 14 years to produce this report. The Taoiseach spoke earlier about the gap between government and citizens and between the political class and the people. This report cannot be allowed to gather dust. The Government has been loud in its rhetoric about the need for political reform, and this is an acute case. A person who does not pay their television licence or an unfortunate woman, crippled by the universal social charge, who steals a loaf of bread or a pint of milk could end up in Mountjoy Prison, yet white collar crime becomes subject to this type of badminton game. Citizens want to know when white collar crime will be dealt with and what the Government will do about these serious issues, which involve public moneys and a public office.

There is no more profound thing than to be elected to represent one's peers. The Taoiseach has been an exemplary representative for a long time and I am aware that he holds that to be a core value. However, we will not narrow the gap if we punish the poor, the working class and those who fall on the wrong side of the law and not take action against those who fleece taxpayers, usurp whatever authority is vested in the Government and who are involved in what is essentially corrupt behaviour.

Enda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context

This report will not be allowed to gather dust. It has been published after 13 years and I welcome it. At the appropriate time there will be ample opportunity for the Members of the House to give their views on the report based on their analyses of it. I understand there are between four and six cases before either the High Court or the Supreme Court arising from proceedings leading to the publication of the report.

Government is about all the people and about not leaving people behind. Everybody shares that view. The bridge between government and the people that has been broken down for a long time must be rebuilt and that can only be done in the context of people seeing that the Government is serious and means business in the interests of the people. The Minister for Justice and Law Reform has already commented on white collar crime and I share his intention to have legislation brought before the House in respect of that matter as quickly as possible.

Finian McGrath (Dublin North Central, Independent)
Link to this: Individually | In context

Health is a major issue for this Government and for the vast majority of people. There are huge problems in our health service but today I will focus on cystic fibrosis services, an issue that must be dealt with over the next 12 months. Will improved cystic fibrosis services for all patients, young and old, be a priority for this Government over the next five years? Does the Taoiseach have a plan to resolve this issue? Does he accept that it is totally unfair, unjust and contrary to good medical practice for cystic fibrosis patients in our hospitals to be exposed to cross infection in accident and emergency departments and in wards? Does the Taoiseach accept that this dangerous, nightmare situation must end?

During the general election campaign the Taoiseach gave a personal commitment to cystic fibrosis patients. Will he act on this over the next 100 days? Where does he stand on the core issue of a designated cystic fibrosis unit at St. Vincent's hospital, with en suite rooms for all patients? Does he support the provision of a 34-bed unit with such separate rooms? Will the Taoiseach stand up for the delivery of this dedicated unit against elements of the HSE and others, who appear to have an issue with conceding the 34-bed unit in St. Vincent's hospital? Two previous taoisigh and a previous Government gave a commitment to this. Will the Taoiseach ensure it is implemented in full?

Approximately 340 patients use the cystic fibrosis services, and 10% or 34 of them often turn up in hospitals requiring the isolated rooms. Thirty-four beds is the key number required to assist these patients. All the professionals, parents and families concerned are seeking that 34-bed dedicated unit. Will the Taoiseach act to ensure that cystic fibrosis patients go to the top of the political agenda?

Enda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context

I am aware of Deputy McGrath's interest in the health area over many years. He has been cogent and articulate in voicing his opinions. I share his view. It is an obscenity that a person should not have treatment provided for them based on their medical need within a reasonable time scale. That is the reason the Government, in its programme for Government, plans to introduce a system of universal health insurance during the lifetime of the Government, to change the ways and the structures in which health services have been delivered.

I have met brothers and sisters of people who have died from cystic fibrosis due to infection of one type or another or due to the required medical treatment and facilities not being made available to them in the way the Deputy and I would expect. I support the proper provision of services for cystic fibrosis sufferers. I do not have all the relevant details with me but I will have the Minister for Health and Children provide the Deputy with an up-to-date report on the situation. Clearly, when we were on that side of the House we made the case for many years about the waste of money in the health service and how money should be redirected to providing proper treatment and services for all patients who need medical attention, although cystic fibrosis is obviously a priority. A state should be able to assist in such provision so people can be provided for in a healthy nation.

I do not disagree with the Deputy's sentiments and I will ask the Minister for Health and Children to send him an up-to-date report on it.

Finian McGrath (Dublin North Central, Independent)
Link to this: Individually | In context

I thank the Taoiseach for his positive response. However, I will judge him on his actions, not his words. How many times is cystic fibrosis mentioned in the programme for Government? Will the Taoiseach establish an accountable structure and centre of excellence for cystic fibrosis patients? The emphasis is on the 34-bed unit. That is the key to dealing with this issue, but there are elements who are hostile to this. With regard to the programme for Government and the principle of medical care being provided on the basis of need, not income - a principle I strongly support - why has a blind five year old girl with cerebral palsy, Hannah May, and six other children had their bridge funding cut by the Department of Health and Children? This money was supposed to support the Jack and Jill Foundation. The foundation needs support to help seriously ill young children. Why is this happening and what will the Taoiseach do about it?

Enda Kenny (Mayo, Fine Gael)
Link to this: Individually | In context

The reason is that it is a dysfunctional health service in many ways. For people who are able to get into the service to access care and attention, the doctors, nurses and those who provide front line services do heroic work in trying and difficult circumstances. I was in University College Hospital, Galway, recently and saw at first hand what the staff must contend with and the pressure under which they work. That is the reason this is happening. I am well aware of the wonderful work, care and attention the Jack and Jill Foundation provides. That type of activity deserves support. That is why on many occasions in the past number of years we have spoken about cases where serious money was wasted within the health service. I recall pointing to the famous PPARS debacle, which cost almost €200 million and never functioned properly. That is not the way things should be for young children such as that blind five year old. For that reason we must change the system and its structure and ensure that moneys are channelled in a way whereby such children can receive the best care and attention.

The programme for Government does not go into the detail of referring to cystic fibrosis, cancer, cardiac disease, obesity or other conditions. It refers fundamentally to the dysfunctional elements of our health system which must be changed. In that respect, cystic fibrosis patients require particular types of facilities and forms of medical attention. I support that. I will ask the Minister for Health and Children to respond to the Deputy in detail about the current situation and his views on this for the future.