Alan Farrell (Dublin Fingal, Fine Gael)
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The purpose of today's meeting is to receive an update from Iarnród Éireann on timetables that were rolled in late August of this year. On behalf of the committee I am very pleased to welcome Mr. Jim Meade, chief executive and Mr. Barry Kenny, corporate communications manager.

I am required to remind witnesses of the long-standing parliamentary practice to the effect that they should not criticise or make charges against a person or entity, either by name or in such a way as to make him, her or it identifiable or otherwise engage in speech that might be regarded as damaging to the good name of the person or entity. Therefore, if their statements are potentially defamatory in relation to an identifiable person or entity, they will be directed to discontinue their remarks and it is imperative that they comply with any such direction.

I remind members of the long-standing parliamentary practice to the effect that they should not comment on, criticise or make charges against any person outside the Houses, or an official, either by name or in such a way as to make him or her identifiable. I also remind members of the constitutional requirement that they must be physically present within the confines of the Leinster House complex in order to participate in public meetings. I will not permit a member to participate if he or she is not adhering to this constitutional requirement. Any member who attempts to participate from outside the precincts will be asked to leave the meeting. In this regard, I ask any member attending via Microsoft Teams to confirm that he or she is on the grounds of the Leinster House campus prior to making a contribution to the meeting.

I look forward to the opportunity to chair this committee. I have dipped in from time to time over the past number of years. Sometimes my experience was good but at other times it was not so good. We will hope for an improvement on that. The committee has some important work to do in the short term, up to whenever the general election is called, not least in regard to this discussion this afternoon but also on legislation which is to come before us including, for example, the national cyber security Bill, which is an important part of the role of the communications side of the committee. I very much look forward to working with colleagues, some of whom I work with across the aisles on other committees and with my constituency colleague, Deputy Duncan Smith. I look forward to working with everyone. As I said in my declaration, I will work without fear or favour. I have a reputation, over the past 13 years, of doing just that in the Oireachtas. I am very much looking forward to working with colleagues to achieve oversight of the Department for which we have jurisdiction and of related agencies, such as Irish Rail, whose representatives have kindly agreed to come before us today. I note, with appreciation, that they were on time today and I thank them for that.

I invite Mr. Meade to make his opening statement.

Mr. Jim Meade:

I thank the Cathaoirleach and the committee for the invitation to attend today to discuss the introduction of our new timetable and the subsequent revisions.

At the outset, I would like to reiterate to our customers, and to the constituents of members, our sincere apologies for the delays and other impacts experienced arising from the timetable issues since the first changes on 26 August. We recognise the level of disruption this has caused to our customers’ work, education, childcare and other requirements and how critical the punctuality and reliability of our services have become to the daily lives of the commuting customers.

I would like to outline to the committee the impetus and process behind the original timetable revisions, the issues which arose, the changes already made and to be made. I will also look forward to capacity improvement plans in place for the shorter term, and how we need to develop our infrastructure to ultimately resolve such issues in the longer term.

Iarnród Éireann is contracted by the National Transport Authority, NTA, to provide rail services under our public service contract with the NTA, ultimately determining services to be delivered. Generally, while there may be minor changes more frequently, we will undertake a full review of the timetable once a year. With the NTA, we will examine the current timetable and opportunities for service improvements. We review customer demand, available trains, driver resources and infrastructure capacity. We will look at broader issues, such as earlier and later Intercity services, for example, and more specific demands and opportunities as they arise.

Since we emerged from the Covid-19 pandemic restrictions, we have been in a position to expand services on a number of routes, notably Portlaoise, Newbridge and Cork area commuter services, as well as improvements to Westport, Cork and Carlow Intercity services.

A number of factors informed our considerations for the 2024 timetable review: the addition to the fleet of 41 new Intercity rail carriages; adding further later evening service options on a number of Intercity routes; expansion of weekend services on Cork commuter routes; factoring in the opening of Belfast Grand Central Station; and addressing track capacity between Connolly and Grand Canal Dock

Iarnród Éireann and Translink have shared an objective of expanding the Dublin to Belfast services to hourly from the two-hourly pattern operating since 1997 for some years. It was a key element of our joint Enterprise strategy published in 2018. The availability of additional fleet from both companies this year, and Exchequer support for operating costs through the shared island fund provided this opportunity. A draft timetable was prepared, liaising with Translink on Enterprise services, and with the NTA on the national timetable. This was published on 30 May for public consultation with a 26 August implementation proposed to align with the availability of most of our new Intercity railcars, and to align with progress with Belfast Grand Central opening. Almost 2,000 customers participated in the process and after some minor revisions the timetable was finalised and published on 9 August.

As with all major timetable changes, we monitor its implementation closely in terms of punctuality performance and impact on customer flows so that if any revisions are required, they can be identified.

While the Heuston Station improvements, and the extra Galway, Waterford and weekend Cork commuter services operated successfully, it became apparent that there were underlying issues affecting the reliability of the new timetable on the Connolly Station side. Most significantly, our timings on both the Maynooth and the northern commuter lines had proven too ambitious. Any delay on our intensively operated network does quickly impact on other routes and there was a cumulative effect which: worsened delays on all routes; caused crowding with customers arriving for following trains boarding late-running ones; impacted on connections at Connolly; and elongating overall journey times

We tasked our operations planning team with identifying revisions which could be quickly implemented to improve punctuality performance. These changes, implemented on 16 September, were primarily timing changes on the northern and Maynooth commuter routes. These did generate punctuality improvements, particularly in the evening. However, morning service issues remained and it was determined that changes which were more structural in nature were required.

As the committee will know, we have now announced that from next Monday, 14 October, more significant changes will be implemented. Full details are now available on our website and app, but the following is a summary of these: morning timetables on routes operating to and from Connolly Station, up to 09.30 a.m. to 10.00 a.m. approximately will revert to the pattern of the pre-26 August timetable, with minor time changes. This includes trains which previously terminated at stations such as Pearse, Grand Canal Dock and Bray resuming operation to and from these stations, reducing the need for interchanges in the morning peak at Connolly Station. There will be revised running times on a number of Belfast services, including changes to times on the 6.00 a.m. and 7.00 a.m. Belfast to Dublin services. As well as improving punctuality for commuter services, this will enable a key gap in the northern commuter morning service to be reduced. By reverting to the structure of the previous timetable, which customers have previously built their commuting schedules around, we believe we will resolve the issues which they have experienced in recent weeks.

In reviewing these issues, a number of factors coincided to cause the delays and crowding experienced over recent weeks. It is always complex, and will remain so, to schedule mixed train types: express, limited stop commuter trains, and frequent stop DART trains, through a twin-track railway. In seeking to deliver a clockface hourly service for the Belfast to Dublin route however, we created too great an impact on our commuter service patterns, particularly at peak times. The interchanges at Connolly in the morning peak exacerbated those delays, with the punctuality issues resulting in missed connections, and longer commuting times for customers. Crowding due to delays was compounded by a significant increase in the numbers commuting. While we always see growth in this peak commuting season, this September has seen it accelerate faster than anticipated.

Again, we are sorry this happened and apologise for it but we have acted, and with the changes from next Monday, we will begin the process of rebuilding our customers’ trust in the service we deliver on the affected routes. I know our customers and members of the committee have already expressed concern about the capacity of our network to accommodate further growth. There is, correctly, major housing expansion planned along our rail lines with a focus on sustainable transport, of which rail can provide the highest capacity, being at the heart of our planning and housing policies into the future.

There are three significant steps which can boost capacity, the first two of which are confirmed. First, the first of 185 new DART+ carriages currently on order are about to arrive. While a complex safety regulatory approval and testing process will follow, from early 2026 we will see a capacity boost from the first of these trains. As they are predominantly battery-electric trains, we will deploy them on the northern commuter route and existing DART lines. Together with electric charging infrastructure in Drogheda, we will be able to deploy higher capacity trains on the route, with improved journey times. We will also free up existing commuter and Intercity railcar trains for use on other lines, meaning all of our networks will benefit from the introduction of this fleet. Further orders of these trains are planned, with up to 750 carriages potentially set to be ordered over the coming years.

The DART+ programme itself is advancing, which will double the capacity and treble the electrification of the greater Dublin area rail network, extending the DART to Maynooth-M3 Parkway, Hazelhatch and Drogheda. The current status of each project is as follows: DART+ West - a railway order has been granted by An Bord Pleanála, with detailed design underway, and construction set to commence in 2026; DART+ South West up to Hazelhatch - a decision on our railway order application is expected soon from An Bord Pleanála; DART+ Coastal North to Drogheda - an application for a railway order has been submitted to An Bord Pleanála with the statutory public consultation ongoing until later this month; and DART+ Coastal South to Greystones - the non-statutory public consultation will begin next month. Additionally, we will shortly finalise and publish the Wicklow capacity study to outline the approach to increase frequency and capacity on this corridor.

Longer term, as referred to above, the conflicts which arise from shared train types on a twin-track railway will remain with us until we increase that track capacity. Between Hazelhatch and ParkWest, we have a four-track railway on the approaches to Heuston, with DART+ South West set to complete the four-tracking into Heuston itself. This allows us to completely separate our express Intercity services to the south and west and our stopping commuter services along this section. We believe this needs to be replicated north of Connolly Station, ideally between Connolly and Malahide, and this ambition is also included in the All-Island Strategic Rail Review. With funding from the Connecting Europe Facility, CEF, we are undertaking a study of the requirements to deliver a four-track section and believe this critical infrastructure should be accelerated to enable continuing service expansion and significant Enterprise journey time improvements.

I thank the Cathaoirleach and members for their attention and I would be happy to answer any questions the committee may have.

Alan Farrell (Dublin Fingal, Fine Gael)
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I thank Mr. Meade very much. Before I bring in our first speaker, Senator Dooley, I want to say that it was appreciated how promptly Irish Rail responded to the request to come before the committee. Indeed, I believe the company heard about this invitation before it received it. It is appreciated that the company came in and made itself available. I am sure I am not alone in the view that the new timetable was nothing short of a disaster both for Irish Rail and for the travelling public. As of last week, and as a person who uses the train six times a week at a minimum, I can say that I arrived at Leinster House or to my home in Malahide on time once while travelling mostly off peak.

The knock-on impact of the timetable was therefore profound and I can only imagine what it must be like for people making longer journeys. I am aware some members commute using the company's services. I am pleased to have the witnesses here but also to note they are recognising the difficulty they put a lot of people in, as demonstrated in both the opening statement and the intention to change the timetable.

I am sure members have numerous questions, as I have, on the potential for the network across the board and how wonderful that potential is. However, it is incumbent upon Irish Rail to maintain the existing level of service and enhance it, where possible. It is clear that is not possible at the moment on the northern commuter line and the Maynooth line. Maybe it will be with some further changes in configurations and signalling, but ultimately it is incumbent on all members to recognise that Irish Rail needs significant investment in order to meet the demands set out in our climate action targets and also just the basic ambition members of the public have to be able to get out of their cars and travel to work or college in a more sustainable way. I will contribute later, but I wanted to make those remarks at the outset.

Timmy Dooley (Fianna Fail)
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Senator Clifford-Lee is standing in for me. Since we are not discussing Galway-Ennis, Ennis-Limerick or the Crusheen station, I shall defer to her.

Lorraine Clifford-Lee (Fianna Fail)
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I thank the Chairman. I appreciate him allowing me to fill in for my colleagues. I welcome the representatives from Irish Rail. As the Cathaoirleach said, they have been very responsive to all of us who have contacted them and we appreciate that. However, I do not think I have seen an issue come to my office that has generated a higher volume of complaints and concern than the changes to the northern commuter line. The level of contact I and my colleagues had was unprecedented.

As the Cathaoirleach outlined, it was a disaster in north Dublin. Commuters on the northern line felt completely abandoned. Major housing is planned and has been delivered in this area and there are huge demands on all the infrastructure. The public transport infrastructure is crucial. Irish Rail heard all the complaints about overcrowding, delayed trains and large gaps in the morning without trains. Changing over to southbound services was a complete disaster. It was dangerous in Connolly Station and added about 20 minutes to the journey time of commuters, which is completely unacceptable. I am glad the company has responded to these complaints and that a new timetable is coming in next Monday. It is eagerly awaited and we will all be watching it carefully to ensure problems do not arise.

I have some specific questions. How many complaints were received about the northern commuter service? What were the nature of the complaints? Did they relate to the change in timetable, the termination of trains at Connolly Station, the overcrowding and the delays in the mornings and evenings? People in north County Dublin are worried something like this might happen again in the future. Public trust has broken down. What reassurances can the witnesses give us that Irish Rail has learned from this fiasco, that it will not be repeated and that the company will work in partnership with the people who use its service day in and day out?

I have a specific request in relation to students attending to Loreto Secondary School in Balbriggan. The evening service has been changed and the service that used to arrive at 4.06 p.m. is now arriving at 3.59 p.m. The girls finish school at 4 p.m., so they are missing this service and it is creating a real difficulty for them and their parents. It is a very large school. There are girls from Donabate, Rush, Lusk and Skerries going to and from school in Balbriggan by train every day. The school is located right beside the train station so there is a good number of students using the train service. It has been very difficult for all of them. As a result, many parents are driving children to school. There is also an issue on Wednesdays when school finishes at 1.20 p.m. There was a service that arrived at 1.26 p.m. but no longer does, which leaves a large gap in the middle of the afternoon. Will Irish Rail look at its scheduling to see whether this issue can be resolved?

Mr. Jim Meade:

I thank the Senator. We very much recognise that this did not work. We overstretched the capacity of the system. We dialled out too much time. We tried to get the quarter or maybe the half-gallon into the pint glass on this. We can see the volume of customers trying to travel with us. We do not have an exact number on the complaints. In overall terms, most complaints came from what we call the northern road - the northern route on that corridor - followed by Maynooth. The Connolly Station side did not work as well as we had anticipated. We were trying to make the whole system more efficient and add capacity. We have put our hands up to say it did not work because we recognise that.

The complaints were on some of the areas the Senator mentioned. They were about overcrowding on trains, trains being late and people arriving for the next train getting on the same train and crowding out those trains. The interchange at Connolly Station did not work. As the timing of trains was not working spot on, people were not getting a cross-platform transfer in two or three minutes. They were waiting the extra ten minutes for the next DART service and this was elongating their journey time. We monitored that very closely in the first couple of days because we wanted to see an improvement. There were certain changes we could make without having to restructure the timetable. That is what we did in September and it did not work. We very quickly saw it did not work. We got complaints from all sides, so then we started looking at how we would restructure. As the Senator will be aware, we are now reinstating the pre-26 August timetable up to mid-morning, until between 9.30 a.m. and 10 a.m., as per my statement. We are reintroducing the through trains through Connolly Stations. While we wanted the interchange to try to get more capacity out of the system, it created more problems than it solved. We now have trains going through to Grand Canal Dock and Pearse Street, as we had before, both cross-city from Maynooth and on the northern road, and indeed all the way through to Bray.

The real push for us is looking at closing those gaps that were created in the morning. We have elongated the times on the Enterprise service to accommodate it and pretty much put the Enterprise back into a slot that was there previously rather than moving any existing trains. We got some commentary back about the train timings that were requested and we had several meetings, including this week, with public representatives that flagged that issue to us. I am happy to tell the Senator that we looked back and closed the gap, bringing it from 4.19 p.m. It is not quite back to where it was but I think we will bring it back to 4.14 p.m. That will give the students a few minutes to get from the school to the station and the train will be there within five to ten minutes, depending on whether the students are quick walkers or slow walkers. That will help. The issue with Wednesdays the Senator mentioned was also raised with us. That does not look to be as easy to do, but we think we have four of five days solved and we will continue to look at whether there is something we can do for the school as regards the time on Wednesdays.

I think I addressed the issues the Senator raised, unless I missed something.

Lorraine Clifford-Lee (Fianna Fail)
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What lessons has the company learned on public consultation going forward?

Mr. Jim Meade:

That is a very good question. We did an extensive public consultation process but in future we will have to highlight key changes such as this. We had good interaction and had a good public consultation, but we did not highlight some of the nuances of the new timetable with the travelling public by corridor. The lesson we have from this is that we will look at future changes in a bit more detail and see how we can raise people's awareness. Some of the issues, for example, the interchange in Connolly Station, were not flagged much, although that one was flagged by some of course. It is about getting the detail out to the travelling public to say this is the timetable and these are the key changes within it and the key things to look at, rather than looking at the whole timetable. Timetabling is an art form in itself, as with any business. We have realised the need, when putting out a full timetable, to break it down by line and route, explain to people how their route is going to change and what to look at on their route and then get feedback from them on it. That is the key lesson we have learned.

Lorraine Clifford-Lee (Fianna Fail)
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That is good to hear. While Iarnród Éireann did have a public consultation, people are very busy with their own lives and do not home in on issues until they are immediate. Mr. Meade mentioned that an evening train will depart Balbriggan at 4.14 p.m. When will that service begin?

Mr. Barry Kenny:

From Monday.

Lorraine Clifford-Lee (Fianna Fail)
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Iarnród Éireann will do further work on the issue with Wednesdays.

Mr. Jim Meade:

We will have a look at it. It is not as easy to shift that service because it involves a whole set of trains. We will look at it. The service on the other four days-----

Lorraine Clifford-Lee (Fianna Fail)
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We discussed this matter yesterday and I thank Mr. Meade for coming back today with a good solution.

Alan Farrell (Dublin Fingal, Fine Gael)
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The Senator has time to spare. On the consultation, I do not mean this flippantly but what possessed Irish Rail to introduce a new timetable on 26 August in advance of the academic year?

Mr. Jim Meade:

That was the time picked by the NTA and us. It was linked with the opening of Belfast Grand Central Station. A brand-new station is being built in Belfast. Following one or two minor delays, the station will open next week and our new timetable was to dovetail with the opening. We have planned for a number of years to bring in the new Enterprise service. Covid had an impact on rail services in the North just as much as it did us, so it is only now that the project is coming to fruition. Our new timetable was primarily linked to the new station and bringing in an hourly service between Dublin and Belfast. We needed to look at timetables anyway and that was the time that was picked.

Alan Farrell (Dublin Fingal, Fine Gael)
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Mr. Meade talked about the learning experience gathered from this process in recent weeks. There are a number of key questions to be asked about infrastructure but I will focus on the passenger perspective for the first part of my questioning. There is or perceived to be an infrastructural deficit at some rail stations, for instance, as regards shelter when large numbers of passengers get off a train at a station where another service commences, such as Malahide and Grand Canal Dock. I am sure there are other stations that other members from other counties could mention, including on the Kildare line. It is lovely to do this in August and September but when the weather turns it is not so great. With regard to the capacity of those stations, Senator Clifford-Lee referred to delays caused by the volume of people trying to get on and off trains and the problem associated with that, not to mention the safety aspect. I ask Mr. Meade to address that.

An obvious issue is how to facilitate DART+ Coastal North and the electrification of the entire network, which is the ultimate aim, without fast-tracking the design, planning and implementation of three- and four-tracking at relevant locations across the network, most specifically on the northern commuter line? I appreciate that the Enterprise service between Belfast and Dublin is a very important offering from the perspective of Iarnród Éireann, the Government, the Oireachtas and interconnectivity. I think I read a report, or anecdotally it was said to me, that Dublin and Belfast are some of the least well served capital cities in Europe. That cannot be a good thing. I ask Mr. Meade to comment.

Mr. Jim Meade:

The last point made by the Cathaoirleach is very relevant. For years, the Dublin-Belfast route has been crying out for an hourly service. They are the only two major cities across Europe, in two jurisdictions, that are not connected by an hourly service.

The Cathaoirleach also flagged an issue with capacity and infrastructure. We are starting with DART+ West, which is the Maynooth line. In order to rebuild the railway there will be some disruption. We are trying to build a new railway while operating a live railway. That will create a certain amount of disruption from time to time. Detailed planning, detailed notification for all our customers and alternative arrangements will be part of the planning process.

I will detail a couple of important facts with respect to the northern commuter line, which is now our busiest corridor. As the previous speaker said, the level of growth and housing on that corridor is significant. We have on order a couple of train orders in place. We have ordered 185 carriages that are battery-electric. That was a very deliberate plan by us because we know how long it will take to build out the electrification process and upgrade the track work to eliminate level crossings, etc., all of which makes the whole process more efficient. Those trains will start arriving and will go into service in January of 2026. The first train set will arrive later this month. There is a long and onerous process of commissioning and regulation involved in putting trains into service, so that will take us a certain time. That is regulated by the European railways agency so we have no choice but to go through the process. At the end of that, we will do one train set, which we call a "head of series", after which we will keep putting in train sets of that type. By the time we reach January 2026, we will have somewhere between eight and 12 train sets ready for service. They will go in together so we will see a step change in capacity on the northern route. These are bigger, brighter and modern trains with a capacity of over 1,000 passengers on a full train set, so they can really shift large numbers of passengers. They are commuter-style trains so they have double-leaf doors or what we call "two-thirds, one-thirds" on the side, similar to the DART trains and northern commuter diesel trains. It will be a real step change in capacity.

Alan Farrell (Dublin Fingal, Fine Gael)
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I am sorry to interrupt but I want to ask about platform safety, particularly in heavily congested stations. Has Iarnród Éireann given any consideration to platform-based doors?

Mr. Jim Meade:

Not in this programme. Does the Cathaoirleach mean corridor doors such as those at some other stations? No, we have not; that is the straight answer. We are upgrading platforms for different reasons. We are bridging that gap between the train and the platform on our new trains. When the trains arrive a step will come out to the platform from every door to bridge the gap as people step on to the trains. Those trains will go on to that route. They are battery-electric so when they get to Malahide they will continue to Drogheda running on batteries. We can charge the batteries in Drogheda or under the wires when they come back. While we are doing the Maynooth line, the corridor out to Hazelhatch, we will be able to give an uplift to the service delivery. The northern route will have all the new trains and we will cascade some of the existing trains on to the other routes, so that we have a capacity increase.

We are seeing substantial growth again. Anecdotally, there has been a jump in passenger numbers of in or around 20% in the year since September 2023. We are seeing large numbers of people migrating on to the public transport system. That is possibly due to people returning to the office, road congestion or other reasons but we have seen that jump. We are seeing a lot of people travelling.

The electrification process will happen. It will be somewhat disruptive but we will manage that. We will protect the working week, from Monday to Friday, and we will always protect important weekends for special events in the city. We will need to go in at times and do the work, however. Commuters on the northern line will see the uplift long before we have that work finished.

Alan Farrell (Dublin Fingal, Fine Gael)
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I with to make two points on Mr. Meade's response, one of which is on communication. It was alleged by a number of people who communicated with me that on-board communication about delays, etc., was patchy at best. I appreciate that was not universally the case and that statement does not capture all trains or drivers but gaps were reported to me. I have had over communications from more than 100 people from all over the place, not just my constituents, undoubtedly because I am the Chair of this committee. I found the number of communications interesting. Perhaps Irish Rail can look into that. It is not necessary for me to get a reply today.

I asked specifically about DART+ Coastal North and how this future integration will work. Deputy Duncan Smith and I are very interested in what happens in Donabate. The Irish Rail website states that the increase in capacity envisaged means that capacity at Portmarnock, Malahide and Donabate rail stations will increase from about 23,300 to 33,800, with the number of services in the three-hour peak window set to increase from 20 to 30. That goes to the point I made at the start of this process a number of weeks ago when I was asked about this. It does not bode well for DART+ Coastal North that a change in the timetable for existing services and the addition of a couple of extra services had this level of reaction by the system and these consequences for the travelling public.

Notwithstanding Mr. Meade's opening statement, which was very helpful and lengthy and I thank him for it, I would like some reassurances. However, there are important considerations for us, as a committee, to take into on the direction we would like to see the Department of Transport, the NTA and Irish Rail take. Are sidings the answer in the short term? Can they be delivered any quicker than three-tracking or four-tracking at certain locations? Can we get over the hump that is the bottleneck at Connolly? What can Mr. Meade say to commuters coming from Dundalk, Balbriggan and places like that who do not want to go to Connolly? They want to go to Pearse or Grand Canal Dock, say, and their option is to get off a train at Connolly. If they are mobility impaired or whatever, they have a bit of journey to get to platform 6 or 7, as is usually the case, and then they have to wait in an area that is congested. That is a regular occurrence. That is morning rush hour. It is not unusual. It has been the case for a long time. I started commuting on the northern commuter line when I was 17 in order to travel to school. From my perspective, it is important that we have a plan. It is 30 years since I did that. There has not been an expansion of the line in the interim. When are we going to do that? What measures should Irish Rail, in conjunction with the other partners in this process, implement?

Mr. Jim Meade:

Those are very relevant and important queries. The new trains and the electrification of the line will bring a level of resilience that we do not have. We have a mixed bag of trains at the moment. We have loco trains on the Enterprise service, diesel commuter trains, diesel intercity trains and electric trains. These are all operating on that corridor, with different performance characteristics. The advent of the new Alstom fleet will standardise the trains on the route. They are basically electric trains that are powered from overhead lines or by means of batteries. They are faster and better trains and will be able to let people on and off more quickly. That will contribute.

As already stated, the connections with Pearse, Grand Canal Dock and all the way to Bray are being reinstated as they were. There will still be some requirement for some transfers at Connolly, depending on people’s journeys, where they are coming from and where they are going, as there always has been. That will always be a feature of train travel. We are not able to go from station to station with every train.

The bottlenecks mentioned by the Chair are there, they are infrastructural bottlenecks, but I am happy to say that under the all-island strategic rail review, we have identified those. They are included in the vision document that the Cabinet, the NTA and the Department have signed off on. The Department is working on identifying the projects to prioritise. It expects to publish information in that regard in the next month or so. It will look at which projects will give us the best return in the short term in the context of improving services. Adding infrastructure, whether it is turn-backs, double-tracking, four-tracking or whatever, increases both capacity and resilience. That is what we need to do. The trains will improve that, as will electrification. Ultimately, however, at a certain point we will need more track infrastructure, which is what the Chair was referring to. That is either a new alignment or four-tracking on the existing alignment at least to Malahide and maybe sections beyond that. That whole corridor, as we all know, will grow significantly and it continues to grow with the level of housing and everything. If we are going to get the full resilience into it, that is what we need over time. However, I am happy to say it is part of the all-island strategic rail review. It is in our plans. It is sitting with the Department and the NTA to say where we go first. We cannot do everything across the country together - the supply chain will not be able to cater for that – but the northern corridor is high on the priority list.

Alan Farrell (Dublin Fingal, Fine Gael)
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I thank Mr. Meade. I call Deputy Smith.

Duncan Smith (Dublin Fingal, Labour)
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I take this opportunity to welcome Deputy Farrell as Chair of the committee. I am delighted that not only has he joined the joined the committee but that he is now Chair. I also want to record my thanks to Senator Gerry Horkan who filled in so well and for such a long time.

I thank Mr. Meade and Mr. Kelly for attending. We know what happened with the timetable changes. We have been through that. The commuters have been through that. I welcome that Irish Rail has responded relatively quickly, to be fair. It is not an easy thing to change a timetable. It takes a lot to go in and change things in the first place. They have acknowledged that mistakes have made and now we have reverted back.

I also want to put on record the issue regarding the Balbriggan train at 3.59 p.m. and its impact on the students leaving Loretto Balbriggan who are decanted further up and down the line. If that could be looked at we would really appreciate it. Councillors Robert O’Donoghue and Corina Johnston and I have been in contact with Irish Rail about that.

The proposed hourly service to Belfast was at the root of the discommoding that arose with the timetable change after 26 August. Who was pushing for that hourly service? Was it Irish Rail or the NTA or did it happen on foot of a ministerial decision?

Mr. Jim Meade:

I will take those questions in the order in which the Deputy asked them. The issue with Balbriggan has been raised with us. It has been raised through the complaints process and by Senator Clifford-Lee too. We are moving it back from 4.19 p.m. and not having the gap in the timetable to around 4.14 p.m., which will help with that school.

On the Deputy’s second point, from 2018 we launched a document jointly with Translink in Northern Ireland with the vision of putting an hourly service in place. It was linked directly with the opening of Grand Central Station in Belfast and with having fleet availability. Translink bought some new fleet and we did too. It is how we sweat the asset best to bring in the hourly service. It was not a Government or ministerial direction. It was directly linked to the opening of Belfast Grand Central Station. That was the imperative, and it has always been there. It has needed an hourly service for a long time. The two cities should have an hourly service just like the service between Cork and Dublin.

Duncan Smith (Dublin Fingal, Labour)
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However, there is the vulnerability of Connolly Station. Out of all the stations, it is probably the one Mr. Meade knows best given his proximity to it. Did he at some point realise when this was coming down the tracks that there would be problems in view of the amount of congestion at the station? Was it ever flagged by Irish Rail that we might stall it and have another look, or was Mr. Meade confident that it would work?

Mr. Jim Meade:

No, we had reasonable confidence that it would work. Do not forget, we have Belfast trains running today on the pre-August timetable. We have had Belfast trains at the peak times. We were trying to get more capacity into the peak for everybody and then move to an hourly pattern because if you can get the pattern right in one hour it just keeps repeating itself throughout the day whether it is commuter, DART commuter, outer commuter or, indeed, the Enterprise services. It was always on our agenda to put it in. We recognise, as I said earlier, that we tightened it and took some resilience out of the timetable. Because we have a train every couple of minutes coming through Connolly the domino effect was significant. However, it has always been on our agenda. Adding to the service, as we have done with other services, has been on our agenda for some time. The northern commuter service has grown over the years, as have services to Maynooth. In the previous timetable we brought it to a half-hourly service. We have increased the cross-city services over the years. It was always on our agenda to bring in the hourly service. It was a timing issue. One of the things we recognised some years ago was that the opening of Belfast Grand Central Station, a completely new station on a greenfield site, was key to delivering that.

Duncan Smith (Dublin Fingal, Labour)
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Mr. Meade used an interesting analogy earlier about trying put a gallon of liquid into a pint glass. Population increase on the northern line continues. It is happening right now. Towns like Donabate and further up the line are all experiencing building. When we talk about a three- or four-track solution along the line, it seems like a long way away. There is also a campaign to retain a direct service on the spur of the DART from Howth Junction to Howth rather than introduce a change at Howth Junction at some point in the future. Given the population increase on the northern line and that we will have limited track capacity will Irish Rail have to continue to prioritise the northern line given the number of people who will use the service in the next couple of years?

At what stage will a decision have to be made on those two spurs coming onto the one track at Howth Junction?

Mr. Jim Meade:

There are two things here. The actual decision is several years away. I will come back to that in a minute. The modelling of the demand has been going on for some time and the Deputy is quite correct that the corridor is growing rapidly. We have grown right across the whole network. We had a minor reference there from Senator Dooley regarding Galway. We are heaving on the Galway route. From Athenry into Galway, we are jam-packed. We cannot get anymore people onto trains and we cannot get any more trains for them. It is happening right across the network for us. Just this week, we launched with the NTA the fact that we are now at 1 million passenger journeys a day in the Republic of Ireland throughout the whole public transport family. This is a new milestone reached and we are seeing people migrating onto it.

We have added new capacity this year. We have nearly all 41 of the new intercity cars out there. The public might be saying they do not see them but that is because the demand is eating up the capacity quicker than we are putting it in. There is going to be a pinch point from now until January 2026. I would not like to mislead the committee or our customers by saying it is going to get easy quickly; it is not. We will start seeing significant capacity going onto the system once we have the extra new Alstom DART trains. They will start to alleviate that. I firmly believe as soon as that extra capacity comes on, we will see more and more migration. We need to continue that programme.

We planned for this in a way. Back in 2019-20, we started looking ahead at where the demand curve was going and we were growing at 4% and 5% per year pre-Covid. We are back growing beyond pre-Covid numbers and we are growing ahead of that curve. We put a framework in place. We did not want to go to procurement just to buy the 41 cars and then go out again and again. Instead, we went out to the market for 750 vehicles, which is a really significant change, and 150 train sets and we put it on what is called a framework order that we could call down. We are hoping to place the third order this year for another 100 cars but we can just call that down and we do not have to go into a procurement process each time we want new trains.

The procurement process following public procurement and EU guidelines is a year and half or a year and three quarters. We have taken that out of the equation until we get the 750 vehicles. That is important for us. As we see the demand grow and as the Department puts the funding in place, we can order further trains. We need to keep ordering trains because we will need that capacity. The network also needs to grow. Adding track capacity is a fundamental piece of the All Island Strategic Rail Review.

Duncan Smith (Dublin Fingal, Labour)
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What is Iarnród Éireann doing to get the track capacity from the vision document Mr. Meade mentioned to actual delivery?

Mr. Jim Meade:

I am happy to say we are currently working with the Department of Transport. We have a team that was with them yesterday looking at what the projects will be for the next five and ten years: what we want done, what will give us the best bang for our buck, where should we double-track and quad-track and where we should put it in. We are identifying those projects as we speak with the Department and we are asking the officials to get the funding put in place to allow us to deliver.

Duncan Smith (Dublin Fingal, Labour)
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I do not want to prejudge Iarnród Éireann's work on that but given what has happened over the past few weeks, I imagine the tracking of the northern line into Connolly Station would be high on that agenda.

Mr. Jim Meade:

It absolutely is. Indeed, last year we applied for some CEF funding and we got funding from Europe to do a detailed study on that. That study is under way as we speak, looking at exactly where we should put track work, how we should do it and how we should increase the capacity on the ground.

Duncan Smith (Dublin Fingal, Labour)
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I have a final question regarding the overall electrification of the line and another issue Deputy Farrell, other Deputies and I will raise, which is the capacity in our electricity network. Has Iarnród Éireann had discussions with the ESB to ensure there is enough power in the system for to deliver what the witnesses want to deliver in the next couple of years or does Iarnród Éireann have concerns about the vulnerability of our network?

Mr. Jim Meade:

I am happy to say we have been planning this with the ESB for a number if years. We work very closely with both the ESB itself and the ESB Networks. We have been identifying where we need substations and how to power them. I have said to the CEO of the ESB previously that we do not turn up with a cable over our shoulders and ask where we will plug it in. We very much planned this hand-in-hand with the ESB. It has a very long lead time on its projects, as do we, so we have been working with the ESB over the past couple of years for the whole DART+ programme. Indeed, we have started looking at the national electrification programme. That is what we would need in the next decade and decades beyond and we are working closely with the ESB on that.

Duncan Smith (Dublin Fingal, Labour)
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I thank Mr. Meade and the Chair for the extra minute.

Steven Matthews (Wicklow, Green Party)
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I join Deputy Smith in welcoming Deputy Farrell on his appointment to the role of Cathaoirleach. He has made many contributions to the committee over the years so he is very well suited to take up the chair. I acknowledge the work Senator Horkan and Deputy Carey did beforehand.

I welcome Mr. Meade and Mr. Kenny to the committee again. They are always very willing to come in and engage with the committee. This must be welcomed because we all want better transport in the country. We want the opportunity for people to leave the car and to provide those options for them. I know the witnesses share those views as well. I was delighted to hear Mr. Meade welcoming the All Island Strategic Rail Review. It is the first time in my memory anyway that we have a strategic assessment of what we could have in respect of railways in this country. It takes long-term planning and a long-term commitment to financially support that type of infrastructure. It is imperative that any future government commits to the review and to prioritise those aspects of it that will give the best and quickest return as well as the best use of public money to help people have that reliable public transport.

From my experience, trying to run mainline trains and a high-frequency suburban train system on the same set of tracks always runs into difficulties. It is very difficult to timetable and to make allowances for things that go wrong, and there are many things that can go wrong. There can be delays with a train for mechanical reasons or because of passengers taking ill on board or signalling failures. That cascades all the way through the network. During peak times, that cascade effect can very quickly have a real impact on everybody trying to travel. The solution to getting that capacity on the northern line and have a high-frequency suburban system is required four-tracking from Connolly Station to Malahide. Any objective analyst would look at it and say that is the solution there.

I have looked at the route and there are a few pinch points. There are a few places it comes close to properties in the Kilbarrack area but it would seem that there is capacity for four-tracking most of the route to Malahide. I missed the reply to Deputy Smith on the analysis of four-tracking on that route.

Mr. Jim Meade:

Any small disruption on a high intensity network is always going to cause us problems. It is tricky to timetable it all when there are different types of trains, as I said earlier, such as local haul trains with diesel commuter trains and electric commuter trains. Getting that pattern and the times right is a bit of a black art. It is all done at the same time. Certainly, the infrastructure side of it is always going to be a question of whether we have that resilience in the network to be able to deal with an incident or not.

I am happy to say that we did get CEF funding to allow us to do a detailed study on four tracks, or 4 North as we call, to understand how we do it, where is the best place to do it and over what distance. If we are to build for the future over the long term, we need extra infrastructure and track work. We know that the greater Dublin area study that the NTA did from 2022 to 2042 recognises that this in the future. It also did some capacity analysis to say when we will need it. That study is there and we will be looking at that. It is revised every four to five years and is due for a revision shortly.

We have outgrown the predicted growth on that route. Based on commentary earlier from some of the Deputy's colleagues, we will outgrow it again because there is such an intensification of housing provision along that route. That is the right thing to do. We want densification on the transport corridors. However, those corridors must be able to support and deal with that densification. They must be able to deal with the nuances the system throws up, whether an electrical or mechanical issue, as the Deputy mentioned, or a passenger issue. We experience all of those issues.

Alan Farrell (Dublin Fingal, Fine Gael)
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I will allow Deputy Matthews back in but I just want to ask, given the funding allocated for those surveys, when does Mr. Meade expect to see a product from that work?

Mr. Jim Meade:

We will have the work done in the next couple of months. It is well advanced.

Alan Farrell (Dublin Fingal, Fine Gael)
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There are several important matters to have the witnesses back before the committee to discuss in the new year, should we still be here. I am sorry for interrupting Mr. Meade.

Mr. Jim Meade:

That is okay. We need to put that infrastructure in place. The report will assist us in that work. As we are outstripping demand at the moment, we probably need to advance it. The real exercise will be about deciding when we do it and how far forward we need to bring it.

Steven Matthews (Wicklow, Green Party)
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The answer to when do we do it is that we start doing it now. There is no better time than now to do it. The situation is not going to get any better. The all-Ireland strategy is good because it does not just talk about running more trains or increasing frequency. It also refers to providing the matching infrastructure that is needed to do that. We cannot just keep cramming trains on the same line. We are aware of that problem and most of us would support the work needed to address it. However, like any other transport project we try to do, there will always be situations that are controversial in terms of land take. We see that with bus corridors and I have no doubt we will see the same with rail. The Kildare route project is a good example of where that worked. It was mostly done in-house. Non-stop fast trains can be run along that high-capacity Kildare line along with suburban services. I was glad to see Kishoge Station open recently. It had been sitting idle for a while. It is another great asset on that route.

Have all of the 41 intercity railcars, ICRs, that arrived in 2023 been allocated to lines? The timetable change affected the Wicklow line. My favourite service is the 9 a.m. diesel train out of Bray. I am glad to see it is coming back. I have a lot of constituents who get on the train at Wicklow town and by the time it gets to Greystones or even Rathdrum, there is standing room only all the way to Connolly Station. It is good to see that demand but is there any possibility of extra carriages at peak times on the Rosslare line?

Mr. Jim Meade:

Somewhere in the 30s of the 41 ICRs are now in service. Over the next month or six weeks, they will all be in service. For clarity, they allowed us to add carriages to existing train sets. In total, there are 27 longer trains out there on the network than was previously the case. All the five-car trains are going to six cars, some four-car trains are going to six cars and some three-car trains are going to four cars. We are adding in capacity on trains. I do not know off the top of my head where they all went but I think some capacity has gone onto the Deputy's route. Galway is a good example of what we have achieved. Not only did we put extra carriages on that route, we also put on an extra service. We are only six weeks in and it is already full. The trains were really heaving before that on the Galway route.

We are putting on extra services and extra capacity but the real issue is that we are seeing growth in excess of what the 41 extra cars can give us. The capacity study for Wicklow is finished and will be published imminently. DART+ Coastal South will help us to expand the services on a corridor that, as the Deputy rightly said, needs expansion. People are standing in the carriages. Some of the second new fleet is earmarked for that corridor. The first 95 cars of the Alstom fleet order will start being delivered into service from early 2026. The good thing about the way we have it structured is that while we are a little delayed with the first train coming in, the whole programme is still on target. By mid-2026, we will have all the first order delivered and in service. We will then go straight into delivering the second order of another 18 train sets. They will go into service over the second half of 2026 and early 2027. Some of them are earmarked to enhance the capacity on the Wicklow services.

Steven Matthews (Wicklow, Green Party)
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That is good to know. We talked about electrification. DART+ will nearly treble the capacity of the current electrified system. Where we bring the battery trains in the electric fleet onto the high-frequency lines, they have much better acceleration capacity and braking capacity. We can get more fleet in and more services operating. Even setting aside the efficiency of electric units in terms of lack of emissions, capacity can be enhanced by running electric trains. I thank Mr. Meade for his engagement.

Frank Feighan (Sligo-Leitrim, Fine Gael)
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I welcome the witnesses. It is a very interesting engagement. Mr. Meade said Irish Rail made a mistake with the timetable changes after 26 August and he hopes there will not be the same disruption again for passengers. Unfortunately, these things happen. He has held up his hands and said Irish Rail will try to do a bit better.

I live in Sligo, in the north west. I will be a bit parochial in my questions. The train from Sligo takes more than three hours to get to Connolly Station. We talk about trying to get motorists off the roads and into Dublin more quickly using public transport. I do not think there is any other train in the country that takes as long. If I drive from Sligo to Roscommon town or even Castlerea, which is further west, I will be in Dublin much more quickly because the trains serving those stations run on a different line. It is a four-track line into Heuston Station. There are huge issues from Mullingar to Connolly Station. The four-track lines are being talked about as the salvation but that will really just be between Connolly Station and Malahide. I am more interested in the line between Connolly Station and Mullingar. There is talk of works that can be done to improve not just the capacity but the journey time of the trains from Sligo into Dublin. A man down the road from me at home has an interest in trains. He has always been of the view that the line could go towards Maynooth or Leixlip and then across land to Hazelhatch and come in at Maynooth. That could be a solution if Irish Rail is having such a difficulty getting four tracks between Connolly Station and Maynooth.

A colleague of mine in Sligo County Council, Councillor Fergal Nealon, has called for an early-morning and late-evening commuter service between Sligo and Longford. It is something we would like to see. People cannot get into Sligo on time for work or socialise in the town and then be able to get home. I take Mr. Meade's point about capacity issues around the country but perhaps a pilot programme or feasibility study could be run. That should be done if we want to get cars off the roads. A lot of work is being done by the NTA with Local Link buses and so on. That is not within the remit of Irish Rail but it all helps to get people out of their cars.

I thank the witnesses for the great work they are doing. I brought members of football clubs up to Dublin many times and we were always treated well on the train. Those were the days when the Republic of Ireland team was going very well. I thank the witnesses for attending the meeting and for their great work.

Mr. Jim Meade:

I cannot let that mention of sporting events go without comment. As a County Clare man and with the Liam MacCarthy Cup back in the county this year, I understand the sentiment of needing to get people to special events. I would say the cup is back in its spiritual home but the Tipperary crowd would not agree with me.

The Deputy mentioned the three-hour journey time from Sligo to Dublin. We acknowledge that. It is a long distance. I am very happy to say that the issue is recognised in the all-Ireland strategic rail review. We are looking at those journey times. The person the Deputy was talking to must have had a glance at the review because we are looking at whether we can come across to Hazelhatch and come in.

That is one of the projects we will examine to see if we can bring some of the trains across that way and into Heuston Station rather than into Connolly Station to try to decongest and further utilise the four-track system. I am happy to say the early services into Sligo are on our radar. Once we start to get that fleet into service that I referenced earlier, that will create a cascade for us. We are putting all that fleet on the northern road because we have the charging infrastructure at Drogheda. They can run under the wires and go to Drogheda and be charged, if necessary, in 20 minutes and be back out again. Then we can take the intercity railcars, ICRs, which are the silver trains that currently run on the Sligo road and are more intercity stock and more suited to a route such as that. We are looking at bringing services back into Sligo in the morning as opposed to just everything heading towards Dublin. In our staff planning, we are looking at having the driver resource in place as well to be able to do that as soon as we have the fleet.

Alan Farrell (Dublin Fingal, Fine Gael)
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Thank you very much, Deputy. I will now move on to non-members. Senator Currie is next.

Emer Currie (Fine Gael)
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I thank the Deputy, and congratulate him on his new role. It suits him.

Mr. Meade and Mr. Kenny are very welcome. I thank them for acknowledging the mistakes of the past five weeks. I also thank their colleague Mr. Richard Kelly in the office who responded to my many emails. I received 93 complaints in one day. Certainly, there was significant pushback on this.

I am based in Dublin West so I am concerned with the Maynooth line. Will the witnesses confirm that all the trains that would have gone to Pearse, Grand Canal Dock and Bray stations will be reinstated as of Monday? That is my first question.

Mr. Jim Meade:

Yes, we can confirm that. We are reinstating the pre-26 August timetable in full between 9.30 a.m. and 10 a.m. We are transitioning to the new timetable after that. The afternoon has worked well, believe it or not. We see the performances come up and that has settled in well but the morning just did not. The morning timetable was wrong. We got it wrong.

Emer Currie (Fine Gael)
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So, Iarnród Éireann is not reverting completely, just in the morning time and sticking to the timetable in the afternoon.

Mr. Jim Meade:

Correct. There will be some interchange coming out of Dublin in the afternoon at Connolly Station.

Emer Currie (Fine Gael)
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Will Iarnród Éireann be monitoring that to see how it works so there will still be opportunities to engage with it if there are still issues?

Mr. Jim Meade:

Absolutely, of course there will. We will be monitoring it very closely, I can assure the Senator. There is ultimate focus on this in-house. We do not like to get things wrong. Nobody does, I suppose. We are certainly aware we have upset a lot of our customer base and that it just has not worked. There is a detailed process we have to go through to make a change. People say to us, "Why don't you just change back?". We have not been able to because we have to take it through a process with the NTA where we get authority from it. We then have to go to the essential functions body, EFB, which is an EU-regulated body. It is a process we have to go through. Then we have to change all our own staff rosters and links. This has actually been a very quick turnaround. There has never been such a short period ever. In fairness to the NTA, it was very co-operative, as was the EFB. Our own staff and trade unions were co-operative in understanding there was a problem and allowing us to make a very quick change. Some of the customers who were travelling do not see it as a quick change because they had to put up with a couple of weeks of disruption when it was not working. I can assure the Senator we will monitor this very closely.

Emer Currie (Fine Gael)
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For this level of change - because it was quite a dramatic change - does Iarnród Éireann think public consultation is the best forum to do that going forward? What mechanism does Iarnród Éireann think it might use to flag these types of dramatic changes that impact commuters, going forward?

Mr. Jim Meade:

Public consultation has been and will continue to be a big part of the process. The lesson we learned from that is we need to flesh out the detail for each route and point people to where the changes are, as opposed to just putting out a complete timetable. People are busy and they do not all get time to get a look at the timetable. They probably have a quick look at their own train and if it looks okay, on they go or they make a comment. The big lesson for us in that is when we make a big structural change like that we need, by line or route, to be highlighting what the changes are what it means, that is an interchange and that times are moving. Maybe there should be more data going out in a more focused manner. Rather than a general public consultation to everybody, we will do a more focused consultation by line or route.

Emer Currie (Fine Gael)
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Can I ask about capacity on the Maynooth line? I went back over my records this morning and from 2020 I have a parliamentary question about the 41 new diesel ICR carriages costing €150 million that were arriving. They were initially due to arrive in 2022 but I think the pandemic slowed that down. At that stage, we were expecting a 34% increase in capacity on the Maynooth line. Was that delivered with the 41 carriages because the belief out there is that the Maynooth line is still very much struggling with capacity at the moment? While the attention has been on the timetable in recent weeks, would it be incorrect to state that simply reverting to business as usual will address all of our issues?

Mr. Jim Meade:

It is quite right. Of the 41 carriages we have 33 or 34 carriages in service and the remaining half dozen or so will go into service during the next number of weeks. It is extra capacity by adding carriages to existing trains. They are not new trains in their own right. They are in the system at the moment. We are seeing a significant jump in ridership across all of the public transport family. Yesterday, we had a function with the NTA and the Minister marking a million passenger journeys per day across the public transport family. We see more people migrating onto public transport.

The trains will still be very busy even though more capacity has gone onto the Maynooth line and the northern and Kildare lines. People do not see that or feel that because the trains are still very busy. Back in 2019 when we started this process the real issue, if the pandemic had not hit, would be that I would be sitting in front of the committee explaining why, during 2020 and 2021 we were leaving people behind because we would have been. We physically would not have been able to carry them because we were growing 5% to 6% per year, every year back then. We have started there again. We believe, anecdotally and we have to nail down the numbers, that we look to be up 20% year on year this year, over last year, in September. More people are going back to work. We normally get an uplift in September with a new wave of college students, etc. That hits us every September. There is a significant growth in passenger journeys out there.

Emer Currie (Fine Gael)
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What increase in capacity has there been on the Maynooth line?

Mr. Jim Meade:

I will have to come back to the Senator with the exact figure as I do not have it and Mr. Kenny does not have it with him either.

Emer Currie (Fine Gael)
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Some of those carriages have gone onto the Maynooth line.

Mr. Barry Kenny:

When we ordered those carriages originally there was a lot of focus on commuter routes. Post Covid, the rapid growth came first on intercity routes, so there are more carriages on intercity routes than would have initially been envisaged, in terms of growth. Ultimately, in a perfect world we would never use these trains on commuter routes because they have that single door at either end and are slower to load and unload. However, they were a solution while the DART+ fleet is being awaited. There would be more of the carriages on the intercity routes such as Galway, which was mentioned as being extremely busy, but they are generally in our system. We will get the figure for the Senator but it would not be to that level.

Emer Currie (Fine Gael)
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It will not be to the 34% level because Mr. Kenny said the intercity dominated coming out of Covid. I would say now that the commuter routes are back with a bang and we need to see an increase in capacity.

There was the 41 new diesel ICR carriages, then I believe 600 electric and hybrid battery carriages were also coming. Where are they in the system?

Mr. Jim Meade:

The number of them is 750.

Emer Currie (Fine Gael)
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It has been increased to 750.

Mr. Jim Meade:

We signed up to a framework in 2021 for 750 battery electric cars. We called off the first 95 of those cars in 2021. The first of those trains arrives at the end of this month. There is a very long and onerous commissioning process. We are heavily regulated so it will take until January 2026 before they go into service. By January 2026 we will have somewhere between eight and 12 of those train sets ready to go. They will all go in together. They will go on the northern road. We have put the charging capacity into Drogheda. They will work under the wires to Malahide and then under battery power from there to Drogheda. That will allow us to cascade some of the diesel trains that are on that onto the Maynooth and Kildare lines and ultimately onto the intercity routes. All 19 of those train sets from the first order will be delivered during 2026 and go into service. Once we get that first train set properly certified and commissioned ahead of series, the rest will come off very quickly. All of the original 19 trains should be in service by mid to late 2026 and then we will go straight into the second order, which we placed the following year.

They will start to be delivered back to back, which is another 18 train sets. They will all come on board through 2026 and into early 2027. They will be for the greater Dublin area but they will also allow us to cascade out to the intercity routes and the Maynooth and Kildare lines.

Emer Currie (Fine Gael)
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There are 750 carriages in total and they will start to become operable from January 2026.

Mr. Jim Meade:

Yes, from January 2026.

Emer Currie (Fine Gael)
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How far out does the contract extend?

Mr. Jim Meade:

The order itself?

Emer Currie (Fine Gael)
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Yes. How long will it take?

Mr. Jim Meade:

It is a ten-year framework.

Emer Currie (Fine Gael)
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It will, therefore, take ten years for those 750-----

Mr. Jim Meade:

Not necessarily. We have a framework for 750 carriages. We only go through the whole procurement framework once. It is an 18- to 21-month process, under EU regulations concerning State funds, to do that procurement process. We only do it once. Historically, we undertook the procurement process for each train order, which led to timelines being pushed out each time. Now, if the Government decides at the end of this year or next year to allow us to order more carriages, which we are expecting, we can have that order placed within six weeks of the Department giving us the green light.

Emer Currie (Fine Gael)
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Okay.

Mr. Jim Meade:

It is a slick process now. We can repeat that at any time within the ten-year framework and up to a maximum order of 750 carriages. If we ordered them all within five or six years, so be it. I could still place a tenth order, or order the last 100 trains, nine years, 11 months and three weeks from the date I signed the framework.

Emer Currie (Fine Gael)
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Can Mr. Meade give an indication of the number of carriages or amount of capacity that will be invested in on the Maynooth line with these new orders? I am aware he will not have that information today.

Mr. Jim Meade:

While I do have that information today, we can certainly detail how the cascade effect will apply.

Emer Currie (Fine Gael)
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The plan is for those carriages to enable Irish Rail to start the electrification processing and build capacity at the same time.

Mr. Jim Meade:

That is a very good point. It means we can put in the capacity ahead of even starting the electrification process. We have just got permission from An Bord Pleanála for the DART+ West to Maynooth. We now have to go into the procurement phase of that. We are one year and a half away from putting shovels in the ground, whereas the timeframe is less than that for the new trains. As soon as the trains are ready, they can go on the existing network. We can give a lift in capacity in advance of the electrification being completed.

Emer Currie (Fine Gael)
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The new trains will be powered by a mix of diesel and battery.

Mr. Jim Meade:

No. They will have electric batteries. They are pure electric trains. They have a battery pack on top of them, so when they come out from under the wires they will be able to travel a distance of between 80 km and 100 km.

Emer Currie (Fine Gael)
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On DART+ West, will the decision by An Bord Pleanála not to go ahead with the Maynooth depot affect timings?

Mr. Jim Meade:

It is not on the critical path. We can handle the first three orders of new carriages with the infrastructure and maintenance facilities we have. We hope to have one of those orders, accounting for 100 carriages, in place before close of business this year. The depot is not on the critical path for those three orders.

While An Bord Pleanála rejected the depot, it had certain criteria it wanted to consider. We are back with An Bord Pleanála looking at whether we can answer the questions it raised or give it other information to see if the depot is viable. We will resubmit for approval within approximately six months. That is the time it will take us to get the information and go back to An Bord Pleanála to see whether we have enough data and supporting information to secure approval for the depot. In parallel with that, we are also looking at alternative sites for the depot. That will be a longer process, however. That is just the nature of it. We have a two-string approach to ensure we get the depot on time. We have several years to do so. We have three, four or possibly closer to five years of work to build out the whole electrification from Maynooth, do the resignalling work and close the level crossings in order to speed up the whole process and get that done. We can do that and use the new trains without the depot for the first three orders of trains.

Emer Currie (Fine Gael)
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Overall, it is not slowing down the timing.

Mr. Jim Meade:

No. It is not on the critical path. We have a lot of work to get on with in the meantime.

Emer Currie (Fine Gael)
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There is no judicial review at this time.

Mr. Jim Meade:

We are still in that process. There are a couple of issues going on but we are dealing with those. It is not formalised yet.

Alan Farrell (Dublin Fingal, Fine Gael)
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I thank Senator Currie.

Emer Currie (Fine Gael)
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Can I make one more point? It is a very small one.

Alan Farrell (Dublin Fingal, Fine Gael)
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The Senator can make a one-way point.

Emer Currie (Fine Gael)
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It concerns Broombridge Railway Station and the Leap card readers. There are four card readers at Trinity, but only two in Broombridge. It is causing queues and people to miss their trains. We would appreciate it if the number of card readers were increased.

Mr. Jim Meade:

We will have a look at that issue.

Darren O'Rourke (Meath East, Sinn Fein)
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I thank representatives from Irish Rail for being here. I apologise that I had to step out of the meeting to go to the Chamber. I will have to go back to the Chamber after this but I can look back at the proceedings later. I might cover ground that has already been covered. On capacity on the northern line, I am particularly interested in the Dublin to Drogheda service. There is an issue between Dublin and Howth Junction and Malahide. Is that recognised as an issue and what is the plan to address it?

Mr. Jim Meade:

One of the idiosyncrasies of the new timetable was that people from Drogheda and Dundalk were very happy with it. We have to try to balance that out with correcting the issues closer to Dublin. The new trains, as we have been mentioning, will be going to Drogheda. We will base them out of Drogheda when that order starts. We are putting the charging infrastructure into Drogheda train station. People in Drogheda will see an uplift in service once those commence in January 2026.

Darren O'Rourke (Meath East, Sinn Fein)
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Is there capacity on the line, in other words, tracks? Do they need to be increased in number?

Mr. Jim Meade:

Ultimately, when it comes to the infrastructure capacity - not the trains themselves but the infrastructure they run on - we have highlighted the need to invest in more track infrastructure in the all-Ireland strategic rail review. We need to try to separate the outer commuters and DART services from the intercity services. We need to bring the Belfast and Dundalk services, etc., in and do what we have done on the Heuston Station side where we have two tracks for intercity services and two tracks for commuter services. That is the ultimate goal. We have certainly called for that. It is just a matter of timing now as to when the Department decides it is best to do it.

Darren O'Rourke (Meath East, Sinn Fein)
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Apart from calling for that, is it on the agenda other than being in the-----

Mr. Jim Meade:

It certainly is because we applied and received some CEF funding to do a study on it. That study is well advanced and will finish in the next few months. It will identify exactly where and what we should do.

Darren O'Rourke (Meath East, Sinn Fein)
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While I suppose the study will indicate some of this, does Mr. Meade have an indication whether there will be a pinch point at a certain stage along Irish Rail’s expansion plans when building capacity on the trains?

Mr. Jim Meade:

It certainly could happen. The initial part of the whole DART+ programme is to build extra capacity through electrification because electric trains can accelerate and brake faster and they are more reliable. We can, therefore, achieve more capacity that way. Ultimately, when we think of the long-term future, we have to be thinking about four-tracking and indeed more tracking.

Darren O'Rourke (Meath East, Sinn Fein)
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What sort of timeline is needed to do something like that?

Mr. Jim Meade:

We are working with the Department to identify the projects we will do in the next five, ten and 15 years under the all-Ireland rail review. The northern route is one of those projects, but we need to identify and call out what will be funded and done first.

Darren O'Rourke (Meath East, Sinn Fein)
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I thank Mr. Meade for that information. The NTA was before this committee a number of months ago. Does Mr. Meade have any indication of when the NTA’s new fare structure will come into being? Has Irish Rail had engagements with the NTA in this regard? As I understand it, the issues are not on Irish Rail's end. Does Mr. Meade have an update on this?

Mr. Jim Meade:

The current indications are that the new structure will come into being by the end of next February. That is when the software will be completed and we can then extend the short hop zone. It is currently going through an iteration. Most of the hardware is in place; it is just about loading up the software. It looks like it will be ready by the end of February.

Darren O'Rourke (Meath East, Sinn Fein)
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Mr. Meade will not be surprised that I am going to ask about the rail line to Navan. The last time he was before this committee, there was an indication that consultants would be appointed. Is there an update in this regard? At what stage is that?

Mr. Jim Meade:

I am happy to say we have appointed a consultant. We developed our own team for it and it is in place. We have a programme lead and some of his team has been put together already. We have also just appointed a multidisciplinary consultancy that will help us do that. That is now formally under way. We have appointed them.

Darren O'Rourke (Meath East, Sinn Fein)
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Consultants have been appointed.

Mr. Jim Meade:

Yes.

Darren O'Rourke (Meath East, Sinn Fein)
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They are funded to do the design piece and to take-----

Mr. Jim Meade:

The railway order.

Darren O'Rourke (Meath East, Sinn Fein)
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Good. When were they appointed?

Mr. Jim Meade:

I am not sure. Mr. Kenny is clarifying for me. The board at its next meeting may need to formally approve it. We have the consultants selected and we will take it through the board process. We will be going to the board at the end of the month.

Darren O'Rourke (Meath East, Sinn Fein)
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Can Mr. Meade say who the consultants are?

Mr. Jim Meade:

Not at this stage.

Darren O'Rourke (Meath East, Sinn Fein)
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No problem. We are enthusiastic.

Mr. Jim Meade:

As soon as the board approves it, we can let the Deputy know.

Darren O'Rourke (Meath East, Sinn Fein)
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We enthusiastically support this project moving on as quickly as possible.

To scan the horizon in respect of the M3 parkway and expansion of services, is there capacity on that line to proceed with Navan rail as quickly as possible? The consultants have all but been appointed and Irish Rail is looking towards the back end of the decade and hopefully early into the next one, all going really well, but some things have to change in the meantime. Is there capacity on those lines? It is a service that will benefit from the company's procurement plans. Could the witnesses outline how they think that might work?

Mr. Jim Meade:

When we do DART+ West, we will add capacity to that line and it has just received the railway order during the summer, as the Deputy will know. We will have that completed ahead of Navan. They will probably dovetail in together quite well and that will add to capacity.

Darren O'Rourke (Meath East, Sinn Fein)
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That again, all going to plan, will line up well.

Mr. Jim Meade:

Yes, it will.

Alan Farrell (Dublin Fingal, Fine Gael)
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I thank Mr. Meade and Deputy O'Rourke. We will do another quick loop. Deputy Matthews and I wish to speak.

I had a couple of little questions, albeit not quite a quick-fire round. One of the suggestions or conversations that I have had with commuters on board and on platforms over the past few weeks, is whether we should expect more trains stopped at stations with diesel - sorry I call them diesels - intercity trains caught doing passing loops and such or is that going to be confined to Malahide and Clongriffin? I think that is a fairly regular occurrence.

Mr. Jim Meade:

It is going to be confined to Malahide and Clongriffin. For us, it is about building the resilience of what we have for the foreseeable future. That means putting in bigger trains and better capacity as the new trains come on line. We have the turnback at Clongriffin and the turnback at Malahide. We will stick to that pattern until we get more infrastructure in.

Alan Farrell (Dublin Fingal, Fine Gael)
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Speaking of train sizes, it was mentioned to me by quite a few people from Malahide that some of the formerly, I presume it was eight-----

Mr. Jim Meade:

Yes.

Alan Farrell (Dublin Fingal, Fine Gael)
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Some of the eight carriage trains have been showing, and it might be more, but they are showing up shorter than usual. Is there some issue there?

Mr. Jim Meade:

We are running a couple of maintenance programmes. One of them is about passenger information systems and one is a programme of repairs that we have to do, would you believe, on the floors of the 29000s. That programme is well advanced and we are changing some of that now as we put back in the extra capacity, because of the growth we have seen this month. We are also using some of our ICR fleet, which is our intercity commuter fleet. They are not ideally suited to commuters but it is just to get the capacity in there. They are the trains with the corner doors and a single file in and out. They are fine but they are slower for commuters to use. They tend to be smaller with four car sets. Again it is a capacity issue. We only have so many trains.

Alan Farrell (Dublin Fingal, Fine Gael)
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For ongoing discussion purposes, what is the average speed of the DART versus what Irish Rail envisage the average speed of the new battery electric train?

Mr. Jim Meade:

The maximum speed of the DART and I would have to check, is either 80 km/h or 100 km/h.

Alan Farrell (Dublin Fingal, Fine Gael)
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The average speed might be more appropriate.

Mr. Jim Meade:

The average speed would obviously be a lot less than that. I would have to check that. I would be absolutely guessing.

Alan Farrell (Dublin Fingal, Fine Gael)
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It would be informative because a lot of people, ourselves included, are trying to comprehend mapping, timetabling and extra capacity. As I mentioned, on your website and as we speak, I think I still have it open, in some three-hour peak times, Irish Rail will go from 11 to 24 services. I presume on the existing DART line, it will go from 20 to 30 services in a three-hour window. If I average that out, you are looking at three extra trains, at minimum, per hour. How does that fit in to the matrix?

Mr. Jim Meade:

There are a couple of features to it. One is that we are moving the Docklands station down to Spencer Dock. This will make it a much bigger station so that we can run a lot more of the M3 Parkway and Maynooth services in there. That frees up capacity. We are re-signalling as part of the electrification programme so that we are able to bring the trains closer together while they are working. We can physically get more capacity in. We can send trains down to the Docklands station as opposed to into Connolly. It is an issue of maximising the capacity of what is there through changes in signalling and through extra capacity at the Docklands.

Alan Farrell (Dublin Fingal, Fine Gael)
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Mr. Meade talked about "four north" which is a good name and easy to remember. Mr. Meade mentioned this is something he expects to be in a position to publish or finalise in the new year. First, regardless of where Deputy Matthews and I happen to be at the time, it would be very much appreciated if we could have an engagement with Irish Rail on that. That would be the start of a very big series of projects for Irish Rail. Reopening of some lines and the expansion of others is absolutely critical as far as I am concerned. I wanted to put my oar in now to have the witnesses in on that at some point in the new year or with the new committee, whichever comes sooner. Also, to reiterate our prior conversation regarding those new carriages and train sets, I am sure some members of the committee would be absolutely delighted if there was an opportunity for us to visit those when they arrive.

My other quick question relates to the strategic rail review. I want to stress this is an "and" not an "or". What is Mr. Meade's opinion on the rail spur to Dublin Airport and how does he believe that such a spur would integrate into the existing northern commuter line? Presumably, it is relatively far out enough that we would already be four-tracked at that stage and therefore would be able to handle the additional capacity.

Mr. Jim Meade:

For a long time, the concept was for there to be a heavy rail link to the airport along with the light rail link or the MetroLink proposed. The airport will need both over time. While many decades ago it was an either-or situation, it is now both. I am happy to say that connectivity to the three key airports on the island of Ireland, namely, Belfast, Dublin and Shannon, are in the All-Island Strategic Rail Review and are called out as a need to do as part of that..

Certainly, trains would be going north of Clongriffin and turning left and going in under the flight path. That would be the route. The Deputy's other point is valid in that the four-tracking would be needed to maximise the capacity of it. As we land the new fleets over the next number of years, and as we said, we have up to a decade to call them off, once you add and create that capacity to carry the people, then this could most certainly be done in time. It is envisaged that we would do it as part of the All-Island Strategic Rail Review.

Alan Farrell (Dublin Fingal, Fine Gael)
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Every time something like this is published, I start getting emails from people saying that we do not need a metro and that the Luas and a spur from the northern commuter line would do it. I have been on radio programmes many times with Trinity College Dublin Professor Brian Caulfield, among others, discussing the fact that the Luas is great but does not have the capacity that is required for Dublin Airport. I agree entirely with what Mr. Meade in respect of it being an absolute necessity. It is an "and". It would be a tremendous connection. In fact, I have already made the suggestion that MetroLink connect to the northern commuter line at Donabate, which is quite logical when you think about the distance and future capacity, particularly if there is larger capacity at Connolly Station. It opens up the opportunity for people along the eastern seaboard to not have to get off the railway. They will be able to get out at Donabate and transfer to the MetroLink.

I have two final remarks, which Deputy Matthews will be pleased to hear. The issue of lighting, lifts and security was raised by my colleagues, Ms Grace Boland and Mr. Eoghan Dockrell, and it is a common theme. I have brought it up with the witnesses before but lighting in lifts in the security sense is obviously extremely important. For mobility issues, Irish Rail seems to have an array of lifts that are constantly out of order. Is it just very unlucky, is it vandalism or has Irish Rail got some sort of maintenance issue?

Mr. Jim Meade:

It is a combination of things. I would not say we have an array of lifts that are out of order. Historically, that was the case. In recent years, we have had a complete programme of replacing and refitting all our lifts.

We did have an element of vandalism but it was only a small element. We put a lift call in place where a shutter comes down in front of the lift. If someone wants to use a lift, they press a call button. The call goes back to Howth Junction, where we have our security facility, and they can see it is not anybody messing but it is somebody who needs to use the lift. The shutter opens to the lift. There is one lift in Clongriffin that is not ours at all. It is a privately owned lift. We are in discussions.

Alan Farrell (Dublin Fingal, Fine Gael)
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If we could start over at Clongriffin, I think we all agree that we would.

Mr. Jim Meade:

Absolutely. We have a programme of refurbishing and maintaining all our lifts and revisiting our lighting. It is nearly complete. For a number of years, during the bad years, we did not invest in that as we did not have the funds. We now have the funds, supported by both the NTA and the Department of Transport. We will continue that programme.

Alan Farrell (Dublin Fingal, Fine Gael)
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You mentioned the upgrades of certain carriages which resulted in smaller trains arriving and things like that. One of the things I identified, when I reported an incident to yourselves in the recent past, was the quality of the cameras at some of the stations. I referred specifically to Malahide but I am sure Malahide is not unique. It was not the best and it was certainly very difficult in respect of quasi-evidentiary purposes. I cannot imagine it is easy to identify people on your videos. Do you have a scheme planned or in place to upgrade cameras?

Mr. Jim Meade:

Yes, I am happy to say that we are going through a programme of renewing and upgrading cameras both on trains and in stations. The new trains will have high-definition cameras with a live link back to a control centre.

Alan Farrell (Dublin Fingal, Fine Gael)
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My final question is about the Howth line. It is my responsibility as Chairman to be impartial but I also have to be a realist. I understand this is still in the planning process.

Mr. Jim Meade:

Correct.

Alan Farrell (Dublin Fingal, Fine Gael)
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You may be limited in what you can say. Am I wrong to suggest that any service provision that is proposed as part of the expansion of the northern commuter line, with DART+ Coastal North and the arrival of DART services beyond Malahide, would see an increase in service, but an inconvenience of having to change that service? What sort of upgrades are you offering to the people of Dublin Bay North at Howth Junction and Donaghmede in terms of access, egress, safety, security and service level?

Mr. Jim Meade:

Certainly we have had representations, particularly from the residents of Howth, about having a shuttle or a direct service. As we maximise the availability of services and maximise the capacity of that corridor, we get more capacity by not going across Howth Junction. Once you cross over the lines, if trains are crossing back and forth they are blocking other trains coming through. That will not happen until the early 2030s, if it happens. It is still very much in the planning stage. No matter what we do, there will always be a facility to go directly to Howth. There is no proposal to take that out in any shape or form. Certainly at weekends, for events and during tourist time we can still go direct to Howth but for the morning peak in and the evening peak out, we will get more capacity across the lines by going direct. We are looking at Howth Junction itself. We need to revisit that station. If we were doing it again, we would not do it that way. That is the honest answer. We will be looking at that station and how we can enhance safety, access and egress, and security. That will be looked at before we make any changes.

Alan Farrell (Dublin Fingal, Fine Gael)
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Thank you. I think I have exhausted my questions. Deputy Matthews is next.

Steven Matthews (Wicklow, Green Party)
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I was kind of enjoying them. I was hoping you would keep going.

Alan Farrell (Dublin Fingal, Fine Gael)
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I have a list here if you want to read them.

Steven Matthews (Wicklow, Green Party)
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I have a final question to ask which is to do with Wicklow. The DART extension to Wicklow town, including a stop at Kilcoole, was included in the National Transport Authority's greater Dublin area strategy two or three years ago. Work is ongoing on design of that extension. Could Mr. Meade give me an update today on how work is progressing on the DART extension to Wicklow town?

Mr. Jim Meade:

Work is progressing. We have part of our capital investment team looking at it. As the Deputy will know, DART+ Coastal South has been split in two and we are concentrating now on Bray south and Wicklow. It is progressing well. We can get the Deputy a detailed report from Paul Hendrick's team if he wishes, which will give him the exact detail. I have not taken a briefing on it very recently but I do know it is progressing well.

Steven Matthews (Wicklow, Green Party)
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Thank you, that is all from me.

Alan Farrell (Dublin Fingal, Fine Gael)
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Thank you. I was trying to find correspondence I received and my office has managed to find it. It is about services on the Wexford line. Apparently there is a five-hour gap on weekdays between the 8.20 a.m. service and the 1.58 p.m. service. The battery on my device has gone; I knew that was coming. It was something I looked at. While the times on the email I received are not quite right, I looked at the timetable. There was a bit of a gap. What I found most alarming was that the distance was not out of this world but it is a very slow train by the looks of it. Can speeds be addressed on that line to improve the service for those commuters?

Mr. Jim Meade:

Speed is something we always look at on the line and we will have a look at the specific example given. We will certainly revert to the Chair on it. When he gets charged up again, if he can provide us with the exact detail we will happily respond. In all our infrastructure works we are constantly looking at speed and how we can upgrade it. We do not just maintain but are constantly modernising and upgrading the speed of the line. Journey time is important for people, absolutely. The three factors we are always looking at are capacity on the services, that people can get on the service, whether it is frequent enough, which is part of the Cathaoirleach's comment, and then how we can reduce the journey time.

Alan Farrell (Dublin Fingal, Fine Gael)
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I will get that along to you. I would appreciate it. Deputy Cathal Crowe heard there was a Clare man in the House so he came in to join us at the last minute.

Cathal Crowe (Clare, Fianna Fail)
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I apologise for being late. I had a meeting at home. I also travelled by car today which is very rare. It is the first time in months. Usually when I am on the train I am one of the first into the room. I thank Mr. Meade and Mr. Kenny not just for being here today but for their continuous engagement. They are fantastic in how they lead out the organisation. I am a regular train user and I can see a lot of improvements personally as I use the services, but also politically. There is a lot in the pipeline. I thank our guests for that.

On the new timetable, there have not been seismic changes in my neck of the woods but I do know that across the network there have been improvements. On ticketing, it is quite standard when booking online that there is a budget price ticket, a semi-flexible ticket and a fully flexible ticket. There seem to be only 12 or 15 budget price tickets per service, something like that. Would it be possible to increase that? There is a bit of Oasis-style dynamic pricing going on. Once they sell out, you move on to the next price category and then the next. The sweet landing spot should be somewhere in the middle, where most people get a value fare. Since I travel regularly I know that if you book in advance, you can get a nice cheap fare and a nice seat, you can have comfort and efficiency, but people who book last minute would find the train service quite expensive. Is there any way that Irish Rail can find the sweet spot in the middle?

Mr. Jim Meade:

We will certainly have a look at it. There is a certain amount of having every ticket trying to cater for all the demands on the services. Encouraging people to book early, whether they go for one of the flexible tickets or the cheapest ticket that is available, does help us plan and understand the demand flows. As we discussed earlier, we are seeing significant growth again this September and are up almost 20% year on year and over 35% the year before. That is not Covid recovery because we are back over Covid numbers anyway. It is just growth in demand. It is something we constantly monitor. The overall ticketing structure and price is governed by the NTA, not by us. We try to put those incentives in underneath the NTA's ticket prices. The semi-flexible ticket has worked really well for us. As regular commuters like the Deputy will know, it gives the option of taking the train before or after the target train with the flexibility of not having to change your ticket. We will certainly have a look. I am not sure if Mr. Kenny knows the percentages.

Mr. Barry Kenny:

It would be variable, basically depending on demand for the train. We are not going to have a very large number of giveaway fares on an extremely busy train.

One factor is that with the Exchequer funding, all fares reduced by 20% in May 2022 and have remained at that level, with the young adult fare going down by 50%. There are very few service industries where we can say in most cases people are paying less than they were ten years ago. We see that with customers. People see the greater value for money that has arisen from that as well.

Cathal Crowe (Clare, Fianna Fail)
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I thank Mr. Kenny. On the greater uptake in usage, is there any additional detail that can be given about the early morning trains that originate in Munster but pass through all the commuter belt towns from Portlaoise on through Newbridge, Celbridge and so on? They are nice, calm trains until they get to Portlaoise and then suddenly there are people standing in the carriages. It all quietens again after 9.55 a.m., but is anything additional being done about the rush hour services?

Mr. Jim Meade:

Yes. We are happy to say that later this month the first of our new train order arrives to go into the commissioning cycle. We call it the Alstom fleet or the DART+ fleet. We have 19 train sets coming and we will something like eight to 12 of them ready to go into service in January 2026. That is a long time, but it is the onerous process we are put under by the European Union Agency for Railways and our regulator, the Commission for Railway Regulation. We just have a very onerous task to go through with a new series of any type. We are not taking any trains out once they start going. We have in total 37 train sets coming over 18 months and the potential to order more, because we have a framework up to 750 vehicles.

Alan Farrell (Dublin Fingal, Fine Gael)
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Sorry, but how many cars are there per set?

Mr. Jim Meade:

They are five-car sets. As they come in that gives us the capacity. Until then we are going to see a lot of standing, especially with commuter trains, because we just do not have the capacity. Between now and then we will have no more new rolling stock. We are in the latter stages of putting in 41 extra cars we purchased for our existing trains just to make them longer, but we can see that capacity has already been eaten up.

Cathal Crowe (Clare, Fianna Fail)
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On the modernising of the fleet, carriage B was traditionally the catering carriage with much of it being taken up with the catering facilities, kitchen and bar area. That does not seem to be a feature of travel anymore. Will it be phased back operationally or will those become more redundant and be replaced with seating?

Mr. Jim Meade:

We would like to see them being phased back in. We have gone back to the market. There was a significant uplift in cost post-Covid. It was very dramatic, because we pay for that service to be provided. We have gone to the market and come back with pricings to bring at least a tea trolley with sandwiches on board. Those costings have now gone to the NTA. It is the NTA and the Department that give the green light and the funding to do that.

Cathal Crowe (Clare, Fianna Fail)
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As the fleet modernises, I am very cognisant of the fabulous work the Railway Preservation Society of Ireland is doing. I went out to Connolly Station recently to visit the locomotive shed. I met Peter Rigney and some of his colleagues. They do fabulous work. I was expecting them to say they had a long list of things they wanted Irish Rail to do, but it was quite the opposite; they said everything they have ever asked for the company has more than obliged. Well done. There is a fabulous partnership going there. I did not realise there was such a partnership going in the North of Ireland as well. It is a real success story. Especially with the DART trains, what we might consider modern now is very quickly becoming the old rolling stock. Might some of that be held back and preserved by the society rather than it all being scrapped, repurposed or sold on?

Mr. Jim Meade:

It is something we do all the time. Like the Deputy I am a great supporter of the society and I know Peter very well. We have a process within our governance that allows us to donate to the society at a very reasonable cost so we preserve the heritage and lineage of the railway. It is important for everyone. It is the second-oldest institution in the State. The only thing that predates the railway, I am told, is the canals. Everything else is post that. I fully support the Deputy's comments. It is very important to acknowledge and maintain the heritage and retain those elements and artefacts of the heritage.

Cathal Crowe (Clare, Fianna Fail)
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I wrote recently to the committee Chairman and the clerk about this. We want to see the new facilities at Heuston, but it would be nice to marry the two on the day and see how the preservation is going. I think a lot of members would have a personal interest in seeing the two so I hope it can happen.

If the Chairman will forgive me, I would like to use my last few minutes to talk about some more local issues. Mr. Meade has been very engaging on the campaign to reopen a rail stop at Crusheen and I would like him to comment on that. It looks like a no-brainer. It is perfectly positioned on the line to Galway. At a time when many students attending college in Galway cannot afford accommodation it would be a very short commute for many of them if this was sorted. It would equally work for Limerick. It is something that has a lot of political buy-in and there is huge community buy-in.

Mr. Meade might also comment on the proposal to have new stops coming out from Limerick out towards Clare with that rail spur to Shannon. It is something I feel very passionate about, as Mr. Meade knows, and he shares that passion. How realistic is all that? If there was an adrenaline shot of funding from Government, how soon could a project like that see the light of day?

Mr. Jim Meade:

I thank the Deputy. The whole western rail corridor is a success story. When it was built in the run-up to the financial crash people thought it was going to be a white elephant and it is anything but that. Back when it opened in 2010 it was carrying just over 180,000 customers and last year we carried just under 630,000. Our problem on it now is we have not got the capacity. I am sure the Deputy is getting regular complaints from his constituents to say they cannot get a seat on the Galway train. I am happy to say we have got some funding from the National Transport Authority to do a capacity study. We are looking to extend the platform so we can put on longer trains as the new trains roll out so we can physically put more capacity on that line.

There is certainly a lot of support for the Crusheen stop, as there is with us. We are happy to build the Crusheen stop as soon as it gets funded. The local authority has procured some land where the station will go to signal its intent to support such an addition to the line. We are ready, willing and able once the funding is put in place.

The Shannon rail link is part of the all-island strategic rail review that all three airports, namely, Belfast, Dublin and Shannon, are connected to the national rail network. We are currently, with the Department, understanding what the phasing will be under the all-island strategic rail review in the sense of deciding what we will do in the next five years, the next ten years and so on. One of the issues we have put on the table is we should start that study and scope it out. Relative to the size of the project it is small funding. I should not say it is only €2 million because €1 million can do an awful lot, but it will take relatively small money to scope out the project, understand the route, get detailed costings put in place and get ready to go to railway order.

Cathal Crowe (Clare, Fianna Fail)
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I thank Mr. Meade. If the Chairman will allow me a final question, I want to bring up car parking. Even at a low level and before we use a sledgehammer to crack a nut it would be really worthwhile if Irish Rail could have someone with a clipboard at the car parks for a few days to do a little survey on where people are coming and going from. The railway car parks across the country have a daily flat rate of €3.50 to park for 24 hours, which is very attractive and useful if you are taking the train to get to point B. The problem is that in some stations in cities and larger towns, people are using the car parks and then walking down the main street to go to work for the day. I get the train from Limerick and I have got crafty and know where to go and what time to get a parking space and so on, because you learn as you go. I have often met people puffing and panting because they have sprinted for the train. We often see elderly people who have had to park 500 m down the street and run to catch the train, or who have missed it and are getting the next one. There needs to be some linkage between the purchasing of a ticket and parking at a train station. I would not change the pricing because it makes it attractive. If someone is paying for a train ticket €3.50 is reasonable and fair, but these should not be catch-all car parks for people going to work, school or the shops. There are other car park facilities in towns and cities people could use. An audit of where people are coming from would be a good starting point.

Alan Farrell (Dublin Fingal, Fine Gael)
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As they are not local authority car parks, I am conscious Irish Rail's car parks are sometimes used as dumping grounds for vehicles. I have seen it.

Mr. Jim Meade:

As have we.

Alan Farrell (Dublin Fingal, Fine Gael)
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Up to and including two vans I reported in that were sitting in Malahide. They move around a little, but I am not sure either is taxed or insured.

I totally agree with Deputy Crowe's suggestion. It would be helpful. I have often looked, and I think offhand that Portmarnock is the only place Irish Rail has expanded an existing carpark. I appreciate there are constraints and there is not a huge amount of land around older train stations. Portmarnock is a relatively young station in comparison with the rest of the line. It would be helpful.

Cathal Crowe (Clare, Fianna Fail)
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I suggest to Mr. Meade that the airports seem to have found a sweet spot on this. When your flight is booked you can book your parking in advance, and as you approach the barrier system it detects your registration, and you drive in. You have bought your ticket and your parking - in you go and out you go. Something like number plate recognition may work so on the app or website you buy your ticket and your car parking and in you go. The current practice is not working so well.

Mr. Jim Meade:

We will take that on board.

Alan Farrell (Dublin Fingal, Fine Gael)
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I thank the witnesses for their time. To refer to Mr. Meade's opening statement, the past number of weeks have highlighted how critical punctuality and reliability are to the services Irish Rail provides for daily commuters. It is why a lot of upset was experienced in both its offices and our own as emails and phone calls started to come in because of the inconvenience meted out to the general public. I am hopeful we can make improvements. I know the committee - and I say this on its behalf - will be very happy to try to help Irish Rail push along the relevant solutions necessary for it to do its job. We thank Mr. Meade and Mr. Kenny for assisting the committee. The meeting is now-----

Mr. Jim Meade:

Before we adjourn, I want to add something, and I apologise for cutting across the Chair. I acknowledge the committee's forbearance with us on various issues over the years. I also acknowledge Senator Horkan and in particular Deputy Carey who is from my own part of the woods and was always a good Chair to us. We wish him well in the future.

We also re-extend the invitation to the committee to have a look at our national train control centre and at the new trains when they arrive. We may write formally and maybe get the committee to Inchicore some time in November to see the new trains in the flesh, our new national train control centre and some of the RPSI equipment we have there. We would welcome the committee.

Alan Farrell (Dublin Fingal, Fine Gael)
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I thank Mr. Meade-----

Cathal Crowe (Clare, Fianna Fail)
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We may not be here in November.

Alan Farrell (Dublin Fingal, Fine Gael)
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We would be interested in having a look at that. I visited the new DART battery electric carriages in Inchicore, but I am sure there are other things. I would be delighted to see the real thing. There is no substitute for seeing the real thing.