Seanad debates
Tuesday, 18 June 2024
Nithe i dtosach suíonna - Commencement Matters
Transport Costs
1:00 pm
Martin Conway (Fine Gael)
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The Minister of State, Deputy Rabbitte, is very welcome to the Seanad Chamber. As always she is very giving of her time with us here. I call on Senator Gallagher to proceed with our next Commencement matter.
Robbie Gallagher (Fianna Fail)
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I ,too, would like to welcome the Minister of State back to the Chamber this afternoon to discuss this topic, which she and I have discussed on a number of occasions. I know it is one she has been working hard on to try to find a resolution to. This relates to the transport charge, which is being levied on some service users who are attending day care services in the community healthcare organisation, CHO, 1, which includes counties Monaghan, Cavan, Donegal, Sligo and Leitrim.As the Minister of State knows, where a member of a family has a disability, the household incurs costs over and above what would be normal for another household. They may face increased costs for heating, light, medicines and other medical expenses, transport and domestic services, to name but a few. As the Minister of State well knows, in light of the cost of living, these extra charges put additional financial strain on families.
What makes this even more disappointing is that the CHO 1 area - the area to which this matter relates - is the only CHO area in the country that is levying these charges. That is unfair. The charge I am talking about is €4 per day, which works out to €20 per week in transport costs that families have to pay. I have spoken to a number of families that include two or more service users. If a family has two or more service users, this charge works out to almost €2,000 per annum, which is a considerable amount of money in anybody's book. The last thing we want is for families to have to reduce their loved ones' attendance at these daycare services, which are excellent, or to cut out attendance altogether.
When the Minister of State and I discussed this matter previously, she understood the problem right away. She was proactive in setting up a committee, which she chaired herself, with a view to finding a solution. She got all the relevant stakeholders around the table to see if such a solution could be arrived at. I look forward to getting an update today on where the Minister of State's work with a view to finding a resolution to the problem has taken her to date.
As stated, the charge is onerous for families, particularly those who have more than one loved one attending daycare services, which are excellent. The current transport service is also excellent. The last time the Minister of Stake spoke on this matter, she said that she was instrumental in carrying out a pilot in County Leitrim using the Local Link service, which is also fantastic, with a view to seeing how it progressed and possibly broadening it out.
This is an unfair charge being levied on families in the CHO 1 area. It is the only area of the country where it is being levied, which is unfair. From the first day I mentioned this issue to the Minister of State, she has been determined to find a solution so I look forward to her response this afternoon. I hope she will give us an update as to where her work on finding a solution to this problem has taken her.
Anne Rabbitte (Galway East, Fianna Fail)
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I thank Senator Gallagher for raising this important matter. Towards the end of this debate, we might go on a journey of my work in the area of transport to date.
The HSE provides specialist disability services, including day services and rehabilitative training, to people with disabilities who require such services. Transport is not considered a core specialist disability service. As such, day services funding does not include transport. However, as part and parcel of my work, I discovered that a minimum of €40 million a year is spent on transport in day services. A variety of transport solutions are pursued in different CHO areas. Where appropriate, travel training is provided to enable public transport to be used, where it can be used. I say that loosely. Other transport solutions include local publicly funded transport such as Local Link services, private bus transport and taxies. Some service providers provide transport where capacity exists. In certain cases, the overall funding for a person's day service may be reduced to provide access to specialist transport. To be honest, that is the last stone in the field. As far as I am concerned, where people are attending day services from 9.30 a.m. or 10 a.m. until 3 p.m., we should not be pulling that back to 2 p.m. in order to ensure that we can make transport work.
CHO 1 works with Local Link to provide a co-ordinated and efficient transport service for all service users going to day services operated or funded by the HSE. The HSE pays 90% of the cost of this day service transport with the remainder funded through passenger fares. The HSE has no remit to provide transport but recognises that services users living in rural areas would not be able to access services without transport supports.The partnership with transport providers commenced in Sligo and Leitrim in 2012. At the time, day services commenced collecting transport fares within the centre. However, some centres do not collect fares and to ensure equity, all passengers now pay fares with the system applied consistently across all the counties the Senator mentioned.
As this specific transport service is deemed a closed service by the Department of Transport, that is, not open to the general public but for HSE service users only, travel passes are not accepted. Service users who are using a public open Local Link bus route to get to their day services can use the free bus pass. However, the Leitrim model is not in existence in many of the counties across CHO 1 to be quite honest with the Senator. The outcome of the Leitrim model is only coming to its end stages now. It is being reviewed with the hope of having it expanded and rolled out further. At this moment in time, however, the Leitrim model is bespoke to Leitrim.
The charge collected on these closed routes contributes to the overall improvement in service delivery, including an increased number of routes, shorter journey times and improvement in the quality of vehicles used. The HSE service provided is safe and of the highest quality and provides door-to-door transport for people attending the HSE-funded services. It is fully accessible, the best value for money and co-ordinated and managed in a professional manner and it is reviewed continually to ensure shorter passenger journey times.
To be quite honest with the Senator, when I was in Dungloe in County Donegal in the middle of last year, I met with a number of service users who brought this particular issue to my attention. They quite justifiably told me about the inequity of what was being asked of them as service users, particularly Theresa, the main advocate who has since written to me in the last ten days. I am currently working on a model to remove that charge. I am having a feasibility study carried out on the costing of the charge to see exactly what it would cost to remove it. I will come back in on the supplementary response, but it is important for me to say that as I make my journeys around the country, I see that some service providers also have charges, perhaps not across entire CHOs but within their particular service provision. I am trying to uncover that as well.
Robbie Gallagher (Fianna Fail)
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I thank the Minister of State for her comprehensive response to me this afternoon. She used the word "inequality" with regard to this particular charge and that is exactly what it is. As she outlined, it is unfair that the people of counties Monaghan, Cavan, Donegal, Sligo and Leitrim have to pay this charge when other service users in other parts of the country do not.
I commend the Minister of State on the work she has undertaken in trying to get this charge removed. We are not there yet, but we are quite close. Would the Minister of State dare to put a timeframe on getting that charge removed to give us some indication and give the families something to look forward to with a view to finding a resolution for this problem? I thank her again for the work she has undertaken and the commitment she gave me at the outset that she is determined to bang heads together to try to find a resolution to this.
Anne Rabbitte (Galway East, Fianna Fail)
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I was very fortunate to secure an additional €5 million in budget 2024 specifically for transport. Both the Department and I are banging our heads together at the moment. However, I am very clear that there are three elements within all of this, one of which would be to remove the inequality whereby people have to pay to attend a day service. The second element is with regard to upgrading some of the fleet within our service providers in once-off funding. The third part would be to work with the likes of Independent Living Movement Ireland, for instance, Galway Independent Living Movement, which already provides transport on a door-to-door basis and operates seven days a week, which gives people the sense of choice as to when they want to access an accessible vehicle to go to functions that are not part of a day service provision. I am currently working on that. I have the money secured. I am told that every time I wish to do a spending line, I have to go to the Department of Public Expenditure, NDP Delivery and Reform for permission.I find that highly frustrating seeing as I secured the funding within the budget, but that is exactly where we are at. My timeline is within the current three months.
Martin Conway (Fine Gael)
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I thank and commend Senator Gallagher on raising this important issue and, indeed, I commend the Minister of State. What the Minister of State is doing is like pulling teeth, but incrementally she is making a huge difference right across her portfolio through a common-sense approach and a little bit of cop-on where it really matters. I thank her for her time because we know how busy she is.