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Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Engagement with Office of Public Works (25 Sep 2024)

John McGuinness: Ms Collier does not have to change my words. It gave the OPW permission and approved. It is all the same.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Engagement with Office of Public Works (25 Sep 2024)

John McGuinness: I am told then that there is a steering group encompassing representatives from both executives. It meets monthly and oversees the implementation of both the standard maintenance and the capital works programme, as well as the commission. Did the OPW meet it separately?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Engagement with Office of Public Works (25 Sep 2024)

John McGuinness: Between the executives. I do not know who is on that working group. Can Ms Collier give us the names of the people?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Engagement with Office of Public Works (25 Sep 2024)

John McGuinness: The commission, with public representatives on it, made the decision and then a non-elected group, albeit a well-qualified group with engineers and God knows what, looks at the scope and the delivery. There is no politician there.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Engagement with Office of Public Works (25 Sep 2024)

John McGuinness: Yes, but this working group is well qualified. They are looking at the progress of this and other projects I am sure. Is that correct?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Engagement with Office of Public Works (25 Sep 2024)

John McGuinness: Yes, that is fine. The PO in the OPW signed off on it. He must have felt quite comfortable signing off on it because all of these very professional eyes were over this project once a month. Is that right?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Engagement with Office of Public Works (25 Sep 2024)

John McGuinness: Yes, but this is a big project; it was €380,000 or whatever it was. Those professionals, you could take it, gave comfort by the fact that they were just there, to the principal officer with regard to the signing off. He knew there were other people who looked at it.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Engagement with Office of Public Works (25 Sep 2024)

John McGuinness: He had the commission, made up of very senior people. He had this working group that was made up of really professional people who knew their stuff and were meeting once a month. Presumably, when he got the costings, he said, "Well, you know, it seems to be okay". All of these people are above his pay grade so he would make certain presumptions from that. Anyway, the project then went...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Engagement with Office of Public Works (25 Sep 2024)

John McGuinness: Mr. Conlon is not happy. Let us not mince words here. He is not happy with that process.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Engagement with Office of Public Works (25 Sep 2024)

John McGuinness: I wonder whether Mr. Conlon's predecessor happy with the process because what is happening now is that the waters are getting muddier and muddier. We do not know who to blame. We do not know who is responsible for it - the nameless PO, the working group or the commission. For me, it is the commission. They are the OPW's client, and it is delivering for them but they could not give a rat's...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Engagement with Office of Public Works (25 Sep 2024)

John McGuinness: We will resume. Deputies Matthews and Tóibín wish to contribute during the second round of questions. Deputy Conway-Walsh will ask questions first, followed by Deputies Fitzmaurice, Matthews, Tóibín, Durkan and Boyd Barrett.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Engagement with Office of Public Works (25 Sep 2024)

John McGuinness: Check the legislation.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Engagement with Office of Public Works (25 Sep 2024)

John McGuinness: It is 4.50 p.m. now and we were supposed to be out of this room by 5 p.m. We will therefore have to set another date with the OPW to continue that broader discussion on that particular issue.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Engagement with Office of Public Works (25 Sep 2024)

John McGuinness: If that letter were to be given to Mr. Conlon and if he were to provide answers to those questions with a detailed note, we would be informed when we have the meeting. I ask the clerk to speak with Mr. Conlon to set an early date for that meeting.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Engagement with Office of Public Works (25 Sep 2024)

John McGuinness: We need a quick answer now, but we can follow up.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Engagement with Office of Public Works (25 Sep 2024)

John McGuinness: The committee, yes. We can follow up.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Engagement with Office of Public Works (25 Sep 2024)

John McGuinness: I am sure that we can seek this information through the committee and the OPW can provide it that way.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Engagement with Office of Public Works (25 Sep 2024)

John McGuinness: I call Senator Sherlock.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Engagement with Office of Public Works (25 Sep 2024)

John McGuinness: The Deputy should reconsider.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Engagement with Office of Public Works (25 Sep 2024)

John McGuinness: The Deputy will be a loss to this House.

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