Ruairi Ó Murchú (Louth, Sinn Fein)
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12. To ask the Tánaiste and Minister for Justice and Equality if she will outline Government plans to deal with the scourge of drugs and drug dealing; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [38177/24]

Ruairi Ó Murchú (Louth, Sinn Fein)
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I am going to ask about the plans to deal with the scourge of drugs and drug dealing, and if the Minister could make a statement on the matter. On the television and on the beat, in any town or village across Ireland, everyone can see with their own eyes the issues that impact greatly. I am talking about everything from organised crime right down to the vulnerable people who are used, and their disorganised, chaotic lifestyle which impacts on the wider community. We need tools across the board for dealing with this.

Helen McEntee (Meath East, Fine Gael)
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I agree that the impact organised crime and those involved in organised crime can have on our communities is devastating. They intimidate and inflict violence and misery on all parts of our community. It is a top priority for me, my Government and this Department to take swift action supported by and supporting the Garda Commissioner and his team. This includes increasing the maximum sentence for conspiracy to murder from ten years to life. This takes into account those who direct gangland crime but do not tend to get their hands dirty. Their active role needs to be dealt with in a different way and that is why I have increased the maximum sentence. We are enacting new laws to criminalise the grooming of children into a life of crime. We spoke of this the other day. It is absolutely imperative that we acknowledge the harm that is caused to younger and younger children as they are dragged and coerced into this life of crime. That is what that legislation is focused on. We are drafting new laws which will provide for the use of facial recognition technology, including in the investigation of certain drug offences.

We are also rolling out support programmes to break the link between gangs and the children they recruit. That is the Greentown project, which is showing great success in the areas in which it is operating. The intention is that we would roll this out on a more nationwide basis. With the Minister of State, Deputy Browne, leading the youth justice strategy and as part of budget 2024, a further €2.9 million was secured for youth diversion measures. This is a 10% increase on the year before, bringing the total budget to over €33 million, meaning that every part of the country now has a youth diversion programme. It is now expanding and looking at more targeted areas, acknowledging in particular that younger children aged seven to nine are now being impacted by this type of activity.

I have also introduced plans to strengthen the State’s ability to seize criminal assets and to target the proceeds of crime. This new Bill will also speed up the process to dispose of the assets for the benefit of the State. The best way we can hit these organised crime groups is in their pockets, taking away their assets and the benefits of their criminal activity and reinvesting that money into communities. In the last three years alone, over €8.5 million has been taken directly from those criminal gangs and invested directly back into our communities and organisations. There is a huge amount of other work being done by An Garda Síochána, which I will touch upon later.

Darren O'Rourke (Meath East, Sinn Fein)
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Go raibh maith agat. I am not going to disagree with anything the Minister has said, other than that the problem is so big and we need a hell of a lot more. I welcome the work that is done by the Garda, the huge operations they have put in play. At times they have put considerable players out of action, even on a town level. Unfortunately, sometimes that takes three or four years to work its way through. Sometimes by the time you get rid of that major drug dealer, the dealers on the street barely remember who they were as other players have entered the field. We have an element of absolute normalisation of drug dealing in working class areas.

Unfortunately, in every bar in every town and village on a Saturday night, there are many people who probably do not break many other laws but think it is absolutely sound to take cocaine. They are putting massive money in to these people. I have seen guys who have had houses taken off them but they are back the next day selling drugs and whatever else. There is great work being done but none of it is enough. We also have a very specific piece of work to do about the vulnerable people who are used but who impact on the communities around them, sometimes more than the dealers themselves.

Helen McEntee (Meath East, Fine Gael)
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This is not an issue that we can deal with alone and that is why An Garda Síochána has significant engagement and very strong links with Interpol and Europol. We have worked very closely with the Maritime Analysis and Operation Centre - Narcotics, based in Lisbon. We have deployed Garda liaison officers to specific countries which we know are problematic where drugs are coming from or which are used as shipping bases for drugs that are then distributed to other areas. Within An Garda Síochána, every division has an inspector tasked specifically with responding to the issue of drug-related intimidation, trying to support those communities that are now impacted.

We also need to look at it from a different approach. While huge investment is going into An Garda Síochána to make sure that it can put in place these operations, such as Operation Tara, supporting the Garda National Drugs and Organised Crime Bureau, which has seized €330 million worth of drugs since 2019 alone, we also need to look at the human side of it, the addiction side of it, and how we can approach it from a health-led perspective. That work is under way at the moment, supported by the Garda. We need to work very closely with the Garda if we are to have an alternative pathway, rather than just the criminal justice process, for those with severe and significant addiction problems.

Ruairi Ó Murchú (Louth, Sinn Fein)
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I submitted another question which I thought might have been up for oral reply today. It must be in for written reply at this stage. It related to the number of gardaí across Louth and in Dundalk, with details of the numbers in drug squads. I will be looking for that.

I agree with what the Minister has said. Obviously, considerable effort needs to be put in on major operations, both internationally and at a street level. I accept that nobody has policed this problem anywhere in the world. I imagine it would take something that nobody in here would countenance. I welcome the work done by the youth diversion projects in Dundalk, including the High Voltage and Team projects. Some of them have early intervention but we need even earlier interventions than are considered there, along with family supports. We are talking about trying to break poverty. I accept we need to put a huge amount of effort into addiction.

I have a specific question about dealing with multiple issues relating to guys dealing drugs in council houses.

Catherine Connolly (Galway West, Independent)
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We are way over time.

Ruairi Ó Murchú (Louth, Sinn Fein)
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The Garda is spending a huge amount of time. Councils do not have the power and Tusla does not have the tools. The Garda does not have the tools at this point in time to deal with these sorts of issues.

Catherine Connolly (Galway West, Independent)
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Deputy-----

Ruairi Ó Murchú (Louth, Sinn Fein)
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It is a huge draw on resources.

Catherine Connolly (Galway West, Independent)
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There are a number of contributors - four extra speakers now. These questions are not grouped. I ask everyone to be as quick as possible because there are Members waiting for their tabled questions and we will finish at 10.30 a.m. I call Deputy Alan Farrell first.

Alan Farrell (Dublin Fingal, Fine Gael)
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I welcome the question and the answer. I particularly welcome the reference to the recreational use of cocaine, which is an absolute scourge on our society. It is right across this country. It is not confined to any particular community; it is everywhere. One of the big issues I have is bringing awareness to those recreational users that they are directly funding organised drug groups, those who target our children in particular and who prey on the vulnerable, addicts and people like that. I would very much welcome the Minister's comments on a targeted campaign to really bring it home to these individuals that it is not okay and that what they are doing is directly funding these individuals.

Cathal Crowe (Clare, Fianna Fail)
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I thank the Leas-Cheann Comhairle for accommodating me. I agree that the only way to deal with this is to hit them where it hurts, that is, in the pocket. CAB has done a lot of good work on it. It seems to me often that the focus of CAB is on the people whose names feature on the front page of the Sunday World every weekend. However, there is a need to get involved at a community level as well. Across the broader community where I live, I can think of several people who openly and unashamedly deal drugs and do so in broad daylight. They do not get up and go out to work like the rest of us during the day. They stay at home. They have every sort of lavish luxury imaginable parked up on their driveway and inside their house. Their neighbours live in absolute fear. Windows have been put in by iron bars and houses have been burned down. We have had everything going on. We need to hit those people financially and go after them because a lot of the time they seem to act with impunity.

Bernard Durkan (Kildare North, Fine Gael)
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I acknowledge the successes of An Garda Síochána, particularly in recent times, by way of interruption and seizing large amounts of illicit drugs. I support the Minister in her efforts to bring about a reduction in drug usage in this country. We need to have a debate but I do not propose to have it here today. Some in the community will say that this needs to be dealt with medically and there is no other way. That is not true. No drugs are safe unless prescribed by a medical person. The medical profession will always tell us that no drugs are safe. We need to get wise, deal with this and cut off the supply while applying the medical remedies as well.

Jennifer Murnane O'Connor (Carlow-Kilkenny, Fianna Fail)
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I agree with the previous speakers. I see the scourge of drugs everywhere. It is about communities. Families come into my clinics heartbroken. Families need to borrow money to pay back the bills for their children who are taking drugs, which is unacceptable. We need to do campaigns and get some sort of help for these families and for the children or people who are taking the drugs. It is a scourge. If we do not get it from the community up, help these families and help those people who are taking the drugs, we are at nothing. I believe we are now in a crisis. I deal with this daily. It is really important that we get to the bottom of this.

Helen McEntee (Meath East, Fine Gael)
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We need to come at this from a number of different angles. There is not one single solution to resolve what is a problem not just in Ireland but right across the world. We need to continue to invest in and support An Garda Síochána to work with its partners across the globe to try to tackle at source the organised crime groups and those who are responsible for producing this. We need to work in communities.

To Deputy Ó Murchú's point, what we have done in Drogheda has been hugely successful, supporting the Garda while also, with the Drogheda implementation report, working with the communities and the addiction and support services, linking in with the education providers, talking to the communities impacted by organised crime in the most severe way, and making sure that every arm of the State is talking to one other and supporting one other. That includes education, telling young people about the negative consequences of their actions and trying to prevent this type of behaviour from starting in the first instance. At the same time, we need to invest in resources to provide supports where there are addiction problems and there are challenges down the line. It is a multifaceted approach.

I commend the Garda on the work it is doing because in recent times there have been significant successes in seizing drugs and taking down so many of those who are involved in organised crime groups and causing this misery in the first instance.

Catherine Connolly (Galway West, Independent)
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There are four Members present who have questions. With everyone's co-operation, we will get to those four questions.