Mr. Fintan O'Brien:

I thank the committee for the opportunity to address it this morning. With me today is my colleague Mr. Brendan Whelan, principal officer in the regional development and innovation unit. I welcome the opportunity to update the committee on the work of the Department in the context of the importance that Our Rural Future assigns to issues of digital connectivity for rural communities. Our Rural Future is the Government’s policy for rural development for the period 2021 to 2025. It sets out a vision for a thriving rural Ireland which is integral to our national, economic, social and environmental well-being and which is built on the interdependence of urban and rural areas. The policy sets out a range of actions to be delivered over its lifetime, with each action assigned to a lead Government Department.

Within this context, the Department of Rural and Community Development is involved in rolling out a number of important initiatives which may be of interest to committee members today. These include: supporting the promotion and availability of remote working spaces in hubs throughout the country; enabling the availability of high-speed broadband connectivity through the broadband connection points; supporting communities in using digital services to provide local activities in rural areas that might otherwise not be available or accessible; supporting the national network of broadband officers in local authorities to facilitate the delivery of high-speed broadband and promoting its benefits; and providing support for innovative digital projects. Through this work and in partnership with our colleagues in the Department of the Environment, Climate and Communications and in local authorities, we are aiming to contribute to the adoption of digital technologies and to closing the digital divide between rural and urban areas.

I will provide a brief overview of the programmes we run or are involved in, which I hope will provide insight into the role of the Department. Regarding connected hubs, while there was a move towards blended and flexible working pre-pandemic, the timeline was greatly accelerated in 2020 because of Covid-19. Our Rural Future recognises the opportunity for rural rejuvenation that remote working presents and commits to establishing a comprehensive and integrated national network of 400 remote working hubs by 2025. In 2021, connectedhubs.iewas launched, providing a shared online booking and payments platform for member hubs and their users. In parallel, the Department has invested significantly to support the establishment, improvement and sustainability of hubs through the range of schemes which make up the Department's rural development investment programme. There are currently 330 remote and co-working facilities across the country, including 58 broadband connection points, BCPs, onboarded to the connected hubs platform, which means we are well on track to achieving our target of 400 remote working hubs by 2025. In addition to facilitating online bookings and payments, connectedhubs.ieis also a platform for collecting and disseminating information, including the types of hubs available in Ireland.

On the national hubs strategy, the Department’s initial priority has been on establishing the connected hubs network, putting the necessary infrastructure in place and achieving the required initial critical mass. Following strong progress on the establishment and awareness-raising phase of the project, our focus has now shifted to the next stage of development. To this end, the Department, in conjunction with colleagues from the Department of Enterprise, Trade and Employment, is leading on the formulation of a national hubs strategy, which will set out the future direction for the national network of hubs incorporating enterprise, remote working and community services at hubs across the country. One of the overall objectives is to ensure the strategic development and long-term sustainability of Ireland’s existing hub infrastructure. Key to this is close consultation with hub sector stakeholders and other Departments and State agencies. The strategy will help inform future decisions and enable a coherent approach to planning and investment in the hub sector.

Within the national broadband plan, broadband connection points were developed to provide on-site connectivity for community use at publicly accessible premises in rural areas with poor broadband availability. There are almost 300 of these community-based hubs distributed around the country. They are located in rural and isolated areas including on a number of offshore islands, and are based in community halls, GAA clubs and tourist attractions that are centres of community life. The goal of the BCPs is that community facilities become empowered through this connectivity, to further support their communities and to embrace new opportunities.

There are a number of pilot programmes currently under way, or recently completed, that explore the potential for BCPs to provide additional public benefit. Over the past three years, BCPs have hosted initiatives such as film festivals, music and art lessons and coding and digital skills classes. Funding has been awarded to successful programmes to continue past pilot stage. One example of a successful programme for digital skills is OurKidsCode. This programme provides creative computing family after-school clubs aimed at helping families enjoy and understand computing, while building parents’ confidence to discover technology alongside their children.

Between 2018 and 2021, the Department provided €2 million under the digital innovation programme to trial innovative technologies across rural Ireland. These projects established the viability and efficacy of a number of technologies, including in the areas of rural tourism and public safety. Some of these projects that members may be aware of include the air quality monitoring project in Trim and the smart ring buoy sensor project.

One of the key elements of supporting greater levels of rural digital connectivity over recent years has been the establishment of the broadband officer, BBO, role in each of the 31 local authorities. This role was established as part of the mobile phone and broadband task force, with co-funding provided by the Department. The officers act as the single point of contact for engagement with telecoms operators, assist with roll-out of the NBP and other telecoms projects and create awareness of, and stimulate demand for, broadband services. They are also centrally involved in the establishment and maintenance of broadband connection points. In early 2023, the Department agreed a new role profile for the BBOs. This new role profile ensures the officers are employed full-time in their role and sets out the importance of their role in implementing new and innovative technologies in their local authority area. In short, the BBOs offer an essential connection between the Government and the local communities we serve.

WiFi4EU was a European Commission project that provided funding for free-to-use Wi-Fi in public areas, such as town squares, parks and libraries. Over 1,000 free Wi-Fi hotspots were installed across 27 local authority areas. The Department committed to match the funding provided by the EU in order to add more Wi-Fi hotspots, effectively doubling the value of the investment. The Department has provided total funding of over €1 million to support this initiative. The WiFi4EU scheme commenced in 2018 and concluded in 2023. A new scheme has not been announced by the Commission at this stage.

The mobile phone and broadband task force plays an important role in the delivery of mobile phone and broadband coverage across the country and is managed in collaboration with our colleagues in the Department of the Environment, Climate and Communications. The initial iteration of the task force addressed many of the telecommunications challenges identified at its inception. The remaining challenges are more complex but no less important, require a high level of collaboration and in many cases have a longer timeframe for delivery.

The task force currently has four main focus areas, which are: improving mobile phone coverage in rural areas; examining issues around planning permissions and licensing for establishing and sharing telecoms infrastructure; the use of public assets for telecoms purposes; and improving the quality and availability of information for consumers of telecoms services and products. All of these issues are closely linked to the delivery of connectivity in rural and remote areas.

I hope I have provided a useful overview of the work of the Department and the role we play in supporting digital connectivity in rural areas. I am happy to take any questions that members of the committee may have.

Mr. Fergal Mulligan:

I thank the committee for the opportunity to provide it with an update on the progress in delivering on the targets set out under Ireland's digital connectivity strategy. I am joined by Mr. O'Donoghue, Mr. Brown and Ms Barron.

This strategy is a commitment that by 2028, every household and business in Ireland will have access to a gigabit broadband service, that by 2030, 5G coverage will be available to all populated areas and that by the close of this year, all schools and broadband connection points, BCPs, will have access to high-speed broadband. The importance of high-speed, quality and reliable broadband is now more evident than ever. After the pandemic, Ireland has, for example, seen a significant transition to hybrid working and remote education.

In recent years, commercial investment in full fibre broadband has consistently increased. These commercial investments, together with the State-backed investment across rural Ireland, will see gigabit broadband rolled out across the State and to all citizens. Recent ComReg reports show a 33% year-on-year increase in full fibre subscriptions, with over 600,000 premises now connected to a gigabit network.

The largest roll-out is underway by Eir, which is rolling out a full fibre connection to the premise network to up to 1.9 million premises and to date, we understand has passed over 1.1 million homes. SIRO has recently reached a milestone of enabling over 555,000 premises for full fibre and is on track to reach 700,000 premises by 2026 through a €1 billion investment. Virgin Media recently announced a €200 million investment plan to upgrade its cable network to bring full fibre to up to 1 million premises over the next three years and recently passed more than 250,000 premises. Eir's 5G network roll-out continues to expand, with coverage to over 70% of the population in all 26 counties. Vodafone's 5G network is currently live in selected areas across 26 counties in Ireland. Three Ireland's 5G network has 85% population coverage. In quarter 4 of 2022, there were 988,000 5G mobile subscriptions, representing a 152% year-on-year increase, and almost 18% of all mobile subscriptions.

The State's investment in NBI is a key enabler for achieving the goals outlined in the digital connectivity strategy. This commitment from Government of up to €2.7 billion will ensure that the future of gigabit connectivity is not just envisaged but is realised well in advance of the target of 2030 set down by the European Commission under its Digital Decade policy.

With the establishment of the digital connectivity office in the Department, the Government is ensuring that every citizen has access to adequate broadband and voice services. This extends to bringing forward proposals under the recently enacted regulations around universal service for broadband and voice, and working with stakeholders through the mobile phone and broadband task force to ensure barriers to investment are removed, where possible.

While NBI will provide full details of its progress to the committee, we understand from its latest reporting to the Department that it has now passed more than 200,000 premises, which is three months ahead of their revised annual target of 185,000. NBI believes it will pass over 300,000 premises by the end of 2024, which will represent over 50% of the national roll-out. NBI also reports that 60,000 premises have now been connected. To date, the level of connections is exceeding initial projections. NBI is connecting circa 3,500 homes each month and expects to have connected over 65,000 by the end of the year. NBI has expressed confidence that it will complete the full roll-out of fibre to all premises by the end of 2026.

The Government and NBI agreed to accelerate the roll-out of high-speed broadband to some 672 primary schools across the State in the intervention area. NBI has confirmed that this acceleration will be complete by the end of 2023, with only three schools remaining to be connected. This will ensure that all schools across the State will have the necessary infrastructure to carry out their critical day-to-day educational activities unimpeded by poor broadband. There is some further work to be carried out by the Department of Education to install some equipment in schools before the broadband service goes live and this will be completed in the coming months.

BCPs are a key element of the national broadband plan, NBP, providing high-speed broadband in every county in advance of the roll-out of the fibre to the home network. ome 295 BCPs, which are publicly accessible sites, have been installed and the wireless high-speed broadband service has been switched on in these locations through service provider contracts managed by the Department of Rural and Community Development. All of these locations will migrate to full fibre broadband once NBI has reached that area.

The Government contract with NBI requires that every premises on every island in the intervention area will be provided with access to gigabit connectivity as part of the overall NBI deployment. To date, NBI has completed fibre deployment activity on 10 islands off counties Donegal, Mayo, Galway and Cork, namely, Eighter, Eadarinis and Inishcoo, Rutland, Inishfree, Carrowholly, Inishlyre, Turbot, Inishturk South, Heir and Long islands. Premises on these islands can now order broadband services with a minimum speed of 500 Mbps. NBI is progressing a further five islands through the design phase. Those island are Owey, Dursey, Horse, Inishbiggle and Achillbeg islands. Sherkin, Cape Clear and Bere islands will be surveyed by the end of 2023. An additional six islands will commence fibre survey and design activity in 2024. These are Tory, Arranmore, Inis Mór, Inis Oírr, Inis Meáin and Inisbofin islands. The Department continues to work with NBI and local stakeholders to accelerate the roll-out to some of the larger islands, such as Valentia and Achill islands.

We will, through the combined efforts of all stakeholders involved, of which there are many, realise a digital Ireland that is inclusive, progressive and leading on the global stage. We are taking on this task and this journey with the assurance that we are building not just for today but for generations to come and to serve all citizens regardless of how remote or rural. We look forward to assisting the committee members with any questions they may have.

Mr. Peter Hendrick:

I thank the committee for having us. I am joined by my colleagues, Mr. Malone and Ms Collins. I thank the committee for the invitation to speak with its members today. We are only too pleased to discuss the latest update on our overall progress with the NBP, as well as to provide a more detailed view of some specific areas that the committee members may be interested in, such as progress in relation to offshore islands.

The timing of our appearance comes on the back of a major milestone for NBI and the roll-out of the NBP. I am pleased to report that as of today, broadband connections on the NBI network will be available to over 201,000 homes, farms and businesses across the country. This milestone means that over one third of the premises targeted by the NBP now have access to our high-speed fibre broadband network. Crucially, this will see the network build surpass our targets for this current year. Further, and as noted recently by the Minister of State, Deputy Ossian Smyth, the NBP has seen a much higher take-up rate than had been originally forecast. With over 60,000 connections live on the network, we are now ahead of the connection targets that would have applied even had there been no Covid-19-related impact to the roll-out. Some 65 broadband providers are contracted to sell services on NBI's wholesale network and the levels of take-up that we are driving not only surpass the targets for this project but also exceed other international comparisons.

As a reminder for the committee, there are currently over 564,000 premises in scope across the Twenty-six Counties and NBI is providing world-class high-speed fibre broadband infrastructure, with minimum speeds of 500 Mbps. In addition, we are already delivering services of 2 Gbps.

The roll-out of the NBP is almost unrivalled in its ambition and complexity, and we are extremely proud of the progress that is being made across every aspect of the roll-out, which I can summarise as follows. Over 77% of premises, numbering 437,000, have now completed the survey and design stages of the programme. Three in five premises, numbering approximately 353,000, have moved to or through construction, with over 38% of all premises, numbering approximately 215,000, now in the build complete category. The number of premises passed by our network and ready to connect is over 201,000, which means the target of 185,000 premises to be passed by the end of the current contract year in January 2024 has already been surpassed. As I have mentioned, over 60,000 premises are now connected, which is significantly above forecasts that envisaged 50,000 connections by the end of the current contract year in January 2024. Take-up rates are above 40% in areas where the network has been live for longer than 12 months and the average take-up rate of 30% is well ahead of projections and international comparisons.

I will now turn my attention to some specific areas that I think the committee may be interested in with respect to the islands, BCPs and rural schools. At NBI, we are working to the mandate from Government to ensure that no town, village or community will be left behind under the NBP. No premises is too rural or too remote.

This means delivering broadband infrastructure to the islands is a natural extension of this mandate. In all, 27 offshore islands included in the intervention area are recognised as stand-alone deployment areas and it is our ambition all islands within our scope will be connected by the end of the programme. Ten of these islands are live and we are actively working on a number of other islands to deliver our new high-speed broadband network.

Given their remote location, unique topology and obvious logistical challenges, the islands undoubtedly present additional complexity and have been poorly served with utilities historically. We are determined, however, to ensure access to high-speed broadband for these locations. NBI’s strong progress on the islands has been made possible with the tremendous support of several stakeholders, namely, the local authorities, the Departments of the Environment, Climate and Communications and Rural and Community Development, the Irish Islands Federation and, most of all, the island residents.

Turning to the broadband connection points, BCPs, and schools, taken together, we are building a network of more than 950 strategically located connection points, or hubs, for community use. BCPs are public locations that have been chosen to receive high-speed connectivity as part of the NBP. These locations have been selected by local authorities and include public areas such as community halls, libraries, sports facilities, enterprise hubs, tourist locations and other public spaces. Some 283 BCPs have been installed with high-speed connectivity by NBI. These sites are the beating hearts of rural communities and have been a critical part of providing accessible, high-speed broadband for rural residents ahead of fibre connections being made available directly to every premises in the intervention area. In respect of schools, NBI is working with the Departments of Education and the Environment, Climate and Communications to connect 672 primary schools to the high-speed broadband network under the NBP. To date, 669 of these schools have been installed by NBI, with the remaining three schools to be connected this month.

Before I hand back to committee members and invite questions, I would like to conclude with some recent analysis that helps place Ireland’s NBP in the context of other projects throughout Europe. In September, the European Commission launched its inaugural report on the state of the digital decade, which provides the most comprehensive review of the EU’s progress towards a successful digital transformation, as set out in the Digital Decade policy programme 2030. Importantly, the report specifically noted Ireland is "expected to make a positive contribution to the collective efforts to achieve the EU’s Digital Decade targets" and, in its summary of Ireland’s performance, called out that “Ireland is progressing well with the implementation of the National broadband plan (NBP) and the connection of primary schools to broadband networks.” It is our view the report rightly highlights Ireland’s leadership position in Europe, and at NBI we are proud to play a key role in expanding the roll-out of future-proofed, high-speed broadband to every premises in the country to ensure equal access and equal opportunities.

I thank the committee for its time. Mr. Malone, Ms Collins and I will be pleased to answer any questions.

Éamon Ó Cuív (Galway West, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

I think this is very useful. I have done a bit of homework. I was listening in my office to this debate and had read the documentation beforehand. At the end of the day, broadband points and hubs are important but they are complementary to what everybody in my area is looking for from me. They are looking for two things, one of which is mobile phone coverage. There are parts of my area, because it is hilly and mountainy, where there is no mobile phone coverage. The second thing they are looking for is fibre broadband. It is very simple. They want fibre broadband. I have always been a big advocate of fibre, as the Chairman knows. I had him persecuted, as Minister, when there was only 30 MB but, in fairness to him, he delivered and came in with fibre. That was a fundamentally correct decision for the country. I fundamentally believe in fibre going to every premises, without exception, and that is also an integral part of the broadband plan. As far as I am concerned, those are two of the biggest decisions taken since we agreed universal electricity was going to be provided to houses.

The figures on the broadband roll-out are very impressive. Can the details of when the survey and the availability of connections will take place be made available? How often does NBI update the website? The only way we know we know it is coming at the moment is that we see the vans looking at the poles, and then we say we can say, judging by how long the survey takes and how long the build out will take, that we will get it in a year, but that information is not available and if I go onto the website, it will see say such and such a figure or whatever it will say. Could a better real-time update be given on when it will happen?

I fully accept we cannot build out this thing overnight. We all know that. Nevertheless, I think we are getting it from the Claremorris side rather than the Connemara side, even though we live in Connemara, and we are at the tail end of the line. Even if it were done on the Connemara side, we would be at the tail end of the line, and then there is the Clifden area, another area that has been slow for roll-out. I understand the logical reason for this; NBI is working from the centre outwards. It is running a parallel system. Even though it is using the poles, its fibre is totally independent of the Eir fibre. Can NBI give more detail to the customer? The website is useful but it is not giving me where NBI is on the different steps Mr. Hendrick outlined regarding the survey. My understanding is it is surveyed and filled and then there is provision.

I compliment NBI on it. I am not surprised at the uptake. I am surprised by those who are surprised at the uptake, and I do not care what the norm in any other country in the world is. I know rural Ireland. Every young one is on broadband and all the older people are on it too. I can guarantee that. I recall during Covid watching older farmers sitting outside the mart in their vans and cars watching the sale of their cattle online. They got somebody to show them how to get in but they got in and used it. I think that despite all the controversy, unfortunately, a lot of people missed the very good bargain that was available in GAAGO at €59 before Christmas last year for the entire season, but if you availed of that, it was a great way of making sure you got access. I used it big time. It made sure that for the lesser known matches, people had access to the broadband broadcast.

On the issue of the islands, my understanding is the contract-----

Mr. Peter Hendrick:

Absolutely. Mr. Malone and I are proactively engaged with the GAA and the GAAGO team. We see there is absolute value in all communications using this broadband network, whether that is broadcast communications or general non-linear communications.

We certainly see the value of the fibre network. I agree with the Deputy. We have always been clear that the future of connectivity for consumers, businesses and farms is with a fibre access network. We looked at this. We spent quite a lot of time, particularly in the bid phase, looking at what the network is going to look like, what the bandwidth utilisation of that network is going to look like and what consumers will use that network for. When we launched, we originally started by talking about 150 Mbps and when we signed the contract, we were thinking about 150 Mbps being the launch product. On day one, by the time we were live with the network, we had actually pushed it to 500 Mbps. We have three services today, 500 Mbps, 1,000 Mbps and 2,000 Mbps, and we see quite a lot of interest in moving to that 1,000 Mbps service.

Of those 65 retail operators, we have 42 that are proactively selling different services, whether that is speed, voice, in-home television applications, broadband services or adding in mobile. Mobile coverage is critical to the people of rural Ireland. I believe the network we are building will support the future deployment of 5G networks to support that rural coverage requirement.

I will hand over to Mr. Malone to talk about the timelines between survey, design and the main build programme and when it will be ready for service. Ms Collins will explain where we are today with our stakeholder communications, how we manage this on the website and how we communicate with end-users and community groups.

Mr. T.J. Malone:

I will give an idea of where we are overall. The Deputy is correct that survey is the first part, and people will see the guys on the road. We take it from there, we bring it back in-house and we do a more detailed design based on what we find out on the roads. On a national basis, we have approximately 85% of the entire country surveyed and 81% is completely designed at this stage. By the end of 2024, we will have 100% of the country surveyed and designed and that then goes into production and into the build phase. As Mr. Hendrick said in his opening statement, we have approximately 63% of the country either constructed or going through construction, and by the end of next year, we will have 84% of it either constructed or going through construction, so we are making huge progress in that way.

As I have always said, building this network is a little like building a skyscraper as there is so much work that goes on with the survey and design on the ground before we actually see it coming up. We are now starting to eat into this and starting to see the numbers being delivered. As Mr. Mulligan said in his opening statement, we are well ahead with this year's targets and, in fact, we are approximately 20,000 ahead.

As the Deputy rightly said in regard to his own area, the further out tends to be the later. That is just the way the design of this network has to work. We lost 12 months coming out of Covid so the seven-year plan looked like an eight-year plan at that stage, although we got eight and a half months of relief from the Department. As we are eating into this at the moment, it looks like we are going to pull the whole of it back in within the original seven-year envelope.

Éamon Ó Cuív (Galway West, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

What is the date? When does the seven years end?

Mr. T.J. Malone:

We are looking at the end of 2026. We are right on target for the end of 2026 or the first month of 2027, which is the end of the seven-year contract. At the moment, we are probably running somewhere in the region of 79,000 homes behind and by the end of next year, we will have that eaten into and we will be approximately 50,000 homes behind. By the end of 2025, we will be right back on track in line with the original seven-year plan with a view to finishing it within that seven-year envelope.

We are making substantial progress. There have been tough yards in the first couple of years but this year has really proved the point and we are hitting a run rate of somewhere between 8,000 and 10,000 premises a month. To put it in layman's language, we are putting enough fibre in the ground or overhead to go from Dublin to Madrid every month, except we are doing it down back lanes and side roads and up mountains, as the Deputy will know from his own area. The progress is good. We have some great teams on the ground. Like anything, there are challenges and risks to that. It is not fully within our own remit over the next two to three years. We are still reliant on Eir's make-ready work and on local authorities granting licences and we are hoping that no further pandemics hit us. As we are progressing through this, we are making progress and we can see ourselves finishing within that period, providing nothing hits us sideways.

Ms Tara Collins:

I thank the Deputy for his questions. We update our website every two weeks. As a wholesaler, we notify our retail service providers at the beginning of the month and in the middle of the month regarding premises that are available for connection.

In terms of the timelines that the Deputy is seeing on the website, there are two sections on the website. The first is the section that we set up in the past few years specifically for political representatives at nbi.ie/reps, and that will give a breakdown by county in terms of where the Deputy’s constituents are expecting to avail of broadband. The way we have it at the moment, it is for 18 months rolling and he will see a three-month window. For 2023 and 2024, the rolling window will be three months. After that, we have 2025 broken down into H1 and H2, and for 2026, which is the last year at the moment, the premises will display as 2026.

We are encouraging end-users, through political representatives encouraging their constituents, to sign up for expressions of interest. If they put their email address into our website, we will be able to give them regular updates via our email channel and email communications. The Deputy will be able to see a county-by-county breakdown but each individual eircode user can see what is relevant to their specific eircode in getting access to broadband.

We are also doing a huge amount of stakeholder engagement through town halls, the tag with the Department of Rural and Community Development and communicating through our broadband officers and directly into the community. In fact, members of my team are in the WhatsApp groups for all of the islands. There is ongoing communication. Next week, we will be on Cape Clear and Sherkin Island and we will be going to Bere Island after that. We welcome as much engagement as possible from constituents, residents and members of the islands federation, who have been fantastic in supporting and helping us to get the word out.

The main request that I have is to please ask people to sign up for registration for GDPR purposes so we can communicate directly with the end user. The best way that we can do it is if they sign up with our website.

Éamon Ó Cuív (Galway West, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

At the end of the day, it always reminds me of a meeting that I was at years ago. We were talking about roads because what do they talk about in rural Ireland but roads? There was a man there who had a very poor boreen to his house and he asked me where all this European money for roads was going. I mentioned a very big road that was 60 miles away from him but still in County Galway, just outside Galway city, and I said that was where the European money was going. He looked at me and said: “I don’t want to go to Oranmore. I want to go to Ballyconneely”, because he was eight miles west of Ballyconneely. The one that is really useful for us, in my experience, is not the general county information. People want to know, “When am I going to get it?”, and that is what they get on to us about.

NBI asks for them to give the eircode. Of course, we tell them to do whatever the website says, and I would certainly encourage constituents to register. Are they getting more information when they register than we are getting on the public version of the website for the same eircode?

Ms Tara Collins:

They will get the granular information through the e-zines that we send out.

Éamon Ó Cuív (Galway West, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

They get more information.

Ms Tara Collins:

They will get more information if they sign up for an expression of interest and we can then target them directly in real time. As I said, our website is updated every two weeks but if we have more real-time information, we will send out an email to them.

Éamon Ó Cuív (Galway West, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

Does that information get updated in respect of the fact that NBI has just started the survey or has just started the build out, and then, obviously, the bingo day? There is a reason that I am asking this. The constituents in the non-NBI area and the non-fibre area, because Eir has fibre as well, are not without broadband. There is virtually nobody without broadband, particularly if there are adults or students in the house who do anything online. Broadband is fairly pervasive but some of them have contracts with other suppliers that are inferior but much dearer contracts involving satellites and everything else.

They have to sign up for a certain period, so the longer and more accurate the lead-in time, the more the contract can be tailored to end at a certain time. I suspect one reason for the time lag in swapping over to fibre is not that people do not realise what fibre does, because broadband users know fibre is the best, but that they sometimes have contracts already and do not wish to double pay. Therefore, it would be useful to know a year or 18 months in advance what is due to happen, including in respect of the various milestones. This would help people to save money and also get what the State is investing in, which is the best service possible. This would be a massive game-changer on the ground.

Even people who use hubs want broadband in the home. A hub has a function other than just providing broadband. In 2027 or 2028, when the whole country will have fibre in every building that wants it, there will still be people going to hubs for various reasons. I used a hub this week but not to use the broadband. I used it because I wanted a meeting between various parties in the most convenient place. The hubs will be very important. One can have online meetings and so on in a neutral space. That said, hub users will also work at home. All of us, as Deputies, are fairly mobile. I always say I have three permanent offices: my office here, my constituency office in Galway, and my home, which is 35 miles from Galway. In addition, I have an office anywhere I go to stay or spend part of a day. My first question in a hotel is whether there is fibre. Nowadays, it is more or less a given. If renting a house for a holiday, a person's first question is whether it has broadband. There are many people living in this reality nowadays, meaning they require pervasive availability.

To go back to the direct point, NBI is stating it can give people accurate updates if they register.

Ms Tara Collins:

Yes.

Éamon Ó Cuív (Galway West, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

Our advice to them, therefore, is to register with their eircode because they will get real-time updates.

Ms Tara Collins:

The communications are twofold. As a wholesaler, we communicate directly with our retailers and we encourage them to migrate wireless customers to fibre. We encourage them to manage that process directly with the end user.

Regarding our own end user communications, if end users have logged an expression of interest, we let them know when the survey and build works are under way and then we let them know about the preorder window, which is really important and gives them 90 days to preorder. Then we let them know when they can order. In addition to communicating by email, we have all our PR activity, including advertising and door drops. If people have not signed up by logging an expression of interest, that being the best way, they will still receive communications from us through campaigns we run, specifically door-to-door ones. We can get letters into the letterboxes. However, the quickest approach for end users is to sign up with an expression of interest, on foot of which we can email them directly and let them know how long they will have to wait. It would be great if the members could encourage them to sign up. We communicate every two weeks. We are updating our website. We communicate regularly on the stages of the roll-out process that have been reached.

Éamon Ó Cuív (Galway West, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

When one person in an area is given information, the oldest form of communication then clicks in, namely bush telegraph – person-to-person communication between neighbours.

Ms Tara Collins:

On that point, the Deputy is absolutely right. We are in the WhatsApp groups for the islands, so as soon as we have an update we inform the relevant one. It goes viral on the ground very quickly.

Éamon Ó Cuív (Galway West, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

It does.

Mr. Peter Hendrick:

The fact we have so many retail operators connected to the network and selling means it is important for the end user to question his or her existing service provider, even if within contract. Many retailers are moving customers to the fibre network because they do not want to lose them to a competitor. They might hold on to them for three or four months after the network goes live, if they try to keep them within the contract, but they will lose them when they are out of contract. We have encountered cases of retail operators supporting people who requested to be moved from the legacy copper or wireless network to the fibre network.

Éamon Ó Cuív (Galway West, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

Let me address a very specific point first. I did not see Clare Island and Inishturk, County Mayo, in the documentation, although I might have read it incorrectly. The southern Inishturk is in west Galway. That is a very technical point.

Mr. T.J. Malone:

The question relates to the Deputy not seeing Inishturk-----

Éamon Ó Cuív (Galway West, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

Could I be told about Clare Island and Inishturk, County Mayo?

Mr. Peter Hendrick:

We have Inishturk, Clifden, which is-----

Éamon Ó Cuív (Galway West, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

No, that is Inishturk south.

Mr. Peter Hendrick:

We have Clare Island as well. Is that the other one the Deputy is asking about?

Éamon Ó Cuív (Galway West, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

The document should refer to the Mayo Inishturk and Clare Island. Could information be got on these? I looked through the document twice but saw only Inishturk south, but that is in Galway, not Mayo.

Mr. Peter Hendrick:

I think it is captured as two islands together. We capture them as one deployment area. That is possibly why the island in question is not included. As an individual deployment area, it is part of another deployment area.

Éamon Ó Cuív (Galway West, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

Let me refer to the big islands. Many of the inshore islands are covered, including the Clew Bay islands. Hare Island, Long Island and other very inshore islands are covered, and there are some connected to the mainland. They will all get fibre. I take it all the mainland islands, including Achill, Cobh and Bull Island, Dublin, will get fibre. What islands will not get a fibre connection from the mainland? I understand NBI was not contracted to provide fibre between the mainland and the islands in certain cases but that distribution is by fibre once the service lands on the island. I am curious to know the islands on which this will be the arrangement. They are mainly the highly populated ones, such as the Aran Islands, Clare Island, Inishturk and Tory. I do not know about Arranmore.

Éamon Ó Cuív (Galway West, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

These would account for 90%. Cape Clear would be in the same position. The witnesses would have to tell us about Bere Island. Could they tell us today, or inform the secretariat, which islands will have a system other than fibre end to end?

Mr. Peter Hendrick:

The contract requires that we deliver a level of service. The level of service needs to be equivalent to that of the predominant urban product available in the market, including the 500 Mbps, 1 Gbps, and 2 Gbps services available to people living in Dublin or Cork. That is the predominant service we are deploying across the entire network. Everybody is getting that service, whether on the mainland or on an island. We are delivering by deploying fibre on the island, so every home will be connected with fibre. There is an important distinction to be made here. We all understand wireless as a mobile service or as entailing an antenna on a house but there are other forms of wireless services, which we call "microwave transport". This is more of a backhaul transport technology. That technology forms part of our network deployment. In this scenario, we deliver the required capacity and resilience to all the islands. On some of the islands, we are delivering capacity of 40 Gbps from the mainland fibre to the island fibre. Some of it can be short-hop and some can be slightly longer, but we have engineered things to deliver the required capacity to meet today's and future demand for the number of homes, farms and businesses that will connect to the on-island fibre.

I appreciate that people have a perception of what wireless technology entails. We are talking about technology that would not typically be connected to a home. We are talking about microwave transport, which is typically used for mission-critical services, high-bandwidth services.

I will give some examples of where we have deployed this over the last 20 years. We have used this microwave transport infrastructure to support backhaul to the metropolitan area networks and fibre networks. Another example is that we have built a network in the Channel Islands connecting Guernsey, Alderney and Sark. It was with Cable & Wireless but we were brought in to deliver the solution for this network. They had fibre on the islands and they connected the transport network between the Channel Islands. We have used and deployed this in critical services, including the Irish Coast Guard, the Irish Aviation Authority, and the 999 emergency call answering service in Navan. That was connected on fibre and we had microwave transport coming from the metropolitan area in Navan. We supported and managed support for An Garda Síochána's Dublin network over a number of years.

Some of the other examples that we have used with regard to very high-capacity microwave transport include all of the broadcast services out of the Aviva Stadium and Croke Park, and RTÉ studios around the country, including Dingle. We have also provided backhaul services on this transport to ESB and several mobile networks. As a wholesale operator, over the last 20 years we have used this microwave transport infrastructure to support wholesale services to Eir, BT, AT&T, Verizon, Orange, Vodafone, Sprint, NTT Docomo, T-Mobile and many others. It is a very heavily engineered solution with high resiliency, high availability and high capacity. We have used this technology for many years, as have many telecommunications companies, so it is very different in how we connect the capacity from the mainland to the island. We are required under the contract to ensure that island users, homes, businesses and farms get the same speed, latency and availability that is available to those on mainland, and that contract prevails for 25 years. The contract requires that NBI delivers that level of service to the end users.

Éamon Ó Cuív (Galway West, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

The questions that I am being asked are, first, are these systems as secure as fibre? I have no doubt that they are but we will have to look into that further. Second, are they subject to contention? In other words, what happens if everyone gets on at the same time? Third, if this is the solution, why is it not being rolled out around the country to the boxes? Fourth, can we have it so that it is the solution for the islands, as opposed to rolling out the cable? This question has nothing to do with NBI because it is just fulfilling its contract. It is actually directed at the Department and the Government.

What I cannot understand is that a lot of the islands need upgraded electrical supplies. With the exception of Inishturk and Tory Island, they are all connected to the mainland with a physical cable. I think Tory and Inishturk still have generators. They originally used to have generators but there was too much hassle, so they put a cable under the ground. There is a strong case to be made to the Department, not to NBI, which should just do its business and just tell us which islands are involved. That is what we need from NBI. I think there is a good case to upgrade the electricity supply for the islands, both inwards and outwards. This would be of assistance if the islands want to export electricity from renewable energy sources, or to import more electricity because they are all using more electricity. It would also give resilience if one cable goes down, as happened in Aran, which got a second cable.

From a technological point of view, I understand that if one is doing that, in the same dredging one could put in a fibre cable at the same time, so the dredging cost would be the same as if one is putting in one cable. We did that again in the Aran Islands in Galway years ago, when we put in electricity and water at the same time when the dredger went across. It dug the water trench and then it dug the electrical trench. The big cost is getting the dredgers there, not the actual dredging. I wonder if the Department has costed the cost to the State of providing the alternative of fibre to the offshore islands that at the moment will not be getting fibre, in conjunction with electricity and in some cases mainland water supply? Water supply is becoming a problem for some islands.

Mr. Fergal Mulligan:

Of the 27 islands - the guys here can confirm - the majority of them, except for Achill which has a land bridge, will be done with full fibre, from end to end. Valentia, which is currently going through a design, is planned to be full fibre, except there is an ongoing discussion with Kerry County Council regarding Valentia Bridge because it opens, and putting a cable over a bridge that opens could be problematic. There is a question as to whether Mr. Hendrick's solution of the point-to-point link versus a cable to Valentia is an option. These are the things we go through in design.

From the point of view of the Department, Mr. Hendrick is right. The contract requires the service to be equivalent of Dublin now and into the future, and once that is delivered to all the residents on the island, that is the contract fulfilled. As part of that proposal, NBI would have given my colleagues their proposed options, and the option of bringing full fibre from the mainland to the islands was looked into from a cost perspective, and mainly a time perspective. The cost perspective NBI put in front of us suggested that the cost of building a subsea cable from the mainland to the Aran Islands could be at least five to six times the cost of the solution they put on the table for the same outcome. From a costing point of view and a value-for-money perspective for the taxpayer, the proposal of one option versus the other was a no-brainer in the end because the solution was going to be the same under the technical proposal that was put forward.

On the time front, if we decided in the Department that we did not like NBI's point-to-point wireless, and we wanted a subsea cable, we would work under the new subsea cable regime through the Maritime Area Regulatory Authority, MARA. I know it fairly well because I am involved in the international project that EirGrid is building to France. Other projects are getting set funding to build to France, Spain and Portugal. There is also a secondary regime through MARA, where one has to go to An Bord Pleanála for cables under water, and do a lot of appropriate assessments and environmental assessments. It is a significant risk to getting broadband to those islands in a timely manner. We recently agreed that of the 27 islands, we will bring forward to 2025 and 2026 seven of them, I understand, that were due for completion in 2027. In the last couple of months we agreed a 12- to 14-month acceleration to islands. Again, that would only be possible with the point-to-point link from the mainland. If we were going down the route of a subsea cable, I fear that we would go years beyond even 2026 to get broadband to the islands. I think that not just the cost but the time is a very significant consideration if it was decided that subsea cables were required.

In the context of co-operation on energy and water, we are not aware of EirGrid or ESB having a plan to upgrade the islands at the moment. I am sure they will have to, given whatever capacity requirements they have. The age of those cables can run from 25 to 30 years, so I am sure they would have a replacement policy. If in the event that they do, at that point in time, of course there will be a discussion to put fibre cables on the same build because the incremental costs will be very little. For example, when EirGrid is doing its connection from Ireland to France, it is putting multiple fibres on the energy supply to ensure we can use those fibres. Again, that is part and parcel of the policy to get from Ireland to Europe with the capacity on subsea cables. Islands would be no different where, be it water or energy, the Department and other respective Departments - of course for energy, it is our own Department - will be liaising with those to make sure there is the maximum amount of infrastructure from the build. If it was one ship building the same cable and putting in extra fibre, the incremental cost would be very little. We just do not have a plan from ESB or EirGrid to do those projects.

Éamon Ó Cuív (Galway West, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

What Mr. Mulligan said is right. I am not dreaming of stopping what is going. I would not in my wildest dreams. However, what I would also say is that Government has to be proactive, and has to go way beyond where the commercial company is going to go. The Government might have to directly fund it, as it did with NBI, and say, "Hang on a second. If we leave it to the commercial market, it ain't going to happen".

I want the Government, with the Department of Rural and Community Development taking the lead, to survey all the islands and see whether it would be optimal from the islands' point of view to improve electricity supply and resilience at the State's expense and to install fibre and water infrastructure and anything else that could be connected to the mainland at the same time. All of the islands should be surveyed and the Government should then provide a programme of fundamental infrastructure upgrades to islands over and above what commercial companies would prioritise. The Government should give the money directly to the companies to do the job, which is basically what happened in the case of National Broadband Ireland, NBI. Nowadays, that would probably have to be cleared as appropriate state aid and so on.

This is why the Department exists. Without it, after cost-benefit analyses, the islands would always be at the bottom of the pack. The whole idea of a Department responsible for the islands was to jump over such analyses and to use a special ring-fenced island fund to make things happen as soon as possible. That can be done in a cost-effective way by taking a cross-cutting approach rather than addressing things individually, such as through someone going in and putting in fibre alone. The islands division needs to drive this and to organise these upgrades. There are precedents for this in the past. European money was used to bring electricity to the islands and then the Department, when it was my Department, dealt with a few tail-end islands that did not have electricity: Inishturk South, Inishturbot, Coney Island and so on. We funded those works directly from the Department. Companies were left to do the distribution but we provided the point-to-point works from the mainland to the islands. We asked whether the companies would use the connections and, of course, they did.

Mr. Fergal Mulligan:

On the first question, I am not saying it is down to licensing. Licensing is one part of the issue. The thing with the subsea cable project is that it is a much bigger project than establishing a point-to-point link. As part of that project, NBI would have to hire the requisite expertise in the subsea cable industry, the relevant environmental assessments would have to be done and the relevant licensing would have to be approved. As it would depend on all of the inputs around environmental assessments, it would be difficult to say with any certainty when a licence might be granted. Due to that uncertainty, it would be very difficult for the subsea cable company that would have to be hired to book shipping and boats. I understand a ship could cost €200,000 a day. If you do not know when you are going to have a licence, you would not book a ship and it can be necessary to book ships up to two years ahead to have them in Galway Bay, ready to put cable down. While there is no one to blame, it causes a lot of uncertainty. I am sure the licensing system will deliver whatever is required but it is a very significant and complicated end-to-end project, as I have seen in other projects from here to Europe that I have reviewed. Subsea cabling is a big challenge. Regardless of whether it is just to an island off Galway or to France, it is a big project and very expensive. In this context, NBI has demonstrated to the Department that it is not necessary.

On the question of whether we will co-operate with other Departments, where appropriate, of course we will. Will it be necessary to put in a duct for fibre? That would have to be assessed on an island-by-island basis and with regard to how much the incremental cost would be, which depends on when the ESB or water network works would be happening. Again, we have not had sight of any projects in the pipeline. If they were in the pipeline, of course we would talk to whatever body was doing the work, whether ESB, Irish Water or EirGrid, in conjunction with our Department. Where it makes sense, of course ducting would be put in. I know for a fact that the incremental cost would be very low so it would make sense to do it. It would certainly make sense to at least put in ducting to prepare for the eventuality of fibre being needed at some point in the future. That would just be a sensible approach to take.

Mr. Fintan O'Brien:

While I do not mean to reiterate what others have said, that issue with regard to the service is core from the Department of Rural and Community Development's point of view. In Our Rural Future and the islands strategy, we have committed to the importance of the delivery of that service. I will admit that I am not an expert on the cost implications of that kind of infrastructural work. I am not aware of any developments regarding that kind of overarching survey across a number of sectors. I can take it away, liaise with other providers and Government Departments and follow up on it. The way we look at it is that we are implementing a number of capital projects across our budget and across islands and rural development in general and we see delivery of that service to islands as part of the national broadband plan, NBP, so there is a cross-cutting implication there. To answer the direct question, I am not aware of any developments regarding such a survey but I can make inquiries about it.

Mr. Peter Hendrick:

The question was whether the same latency is delivered between the mainland and the island through fibre as through microwave transport. Both transmit a radio frequency, RF, signal. With fibre, it is a very high ultraviolet RF signal. Effectively, it is light. Both travel at the same speed but the medium is different. One is over glass and one is over air. As I have said, the actual transport from A to B is the same.

Mr. Peter Hendrick:

It goes through active equipment at either end.

Mr. Peter Hendrick:

With the technology we are using, it will be the same.

Mr. Peter Hendrick:

The only place in which we convert the transport signal down to an RF signal is at the terminating points of the radio link at either end. It goes from an RF signal to an electrical signal and back to an optical signal. In that, you are talking about something in the region of 0.125 microseconds.

Mr. Peter Hendrick:

Exactly. It is well within the terms typically seen for any fibre network. It must be understood that the difference between the NBI network and many traditional networks is that we do not have a lot of active node points in the network. There are 227 deployment areas in which we have active equipment.

We hand back to the retail operators in 33 regional points of handover or two data centres in Dublin. Once we go into those broadband networks every point of exchange on their network also introduces some sort of latency. Even with all of that, let us call it optical to electrical transfer of connectivity, we are still talking about a sub-10 ms round trip.

Eugene Murphy (Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

I had to cover another meeting. I am going to keep this very brief because some of the questions were probably answered when I was away.

First, I thank the Chair for his role when he was the Minister. In no small way his enthusiasm brought on this broadband project to the island and islands in leaps and bounds. I also acknowledge the officials who worked with him and those who are here with us today.

I do not really care who answers the question. We have brought the fibre line so far and then it stops and there are 4 km or 5 km left where people cannot join up. I am a victim of this myself even with my Oireachtas line at home and my neighbours are the same way. We have been told it will be four or five years more. I could give several examples. The Chair knows of this himself. Is there anything that can be done to speed it up for people who need broadband but because of the gap that has been left, there is no chance in most cases of getting it for four or five years?

I will finish with this second point. Firms are not realising their potential because of the lack of broadband. The Chair knows the firm we talk about in north Roscommon, the Hanly group with 120 workers, which is prepared to dig up an area, put down poles and do everything but its chance of getting broadband is three years down the road. Is there anything that can be done for firms like that? I spoke to the Minister of State, Deputy Ossian Smyth, about this and he mentioned the hub. Realistically, a hub is not the answer to a business with 120 workers. There is no doubt that the company is losing out on business. They tell me they could be employing 30 more people if they had the broadband. They are my two questions.

Mr. Peter Hendrick:

I thank the Senator. I will take the question about people who have to wait a number of years for high-speed fibre broadband. For commercial areas, if somebody today is on a greater than 30 Mbps service, it may be delivered on copper or a coaxial cable and once they are above 30 mbps they are not part of the national broadband plan. Based on the announcements from Eir, Virgin, Siro and others, we do believe that there is an intent for those operators to migrate off of those copper and coaxial cable networks onto fibre. Obviously they have got a roll-out plan and a timeline associated with that but we understand that is their intent.

On the NBP roll-out, the way our network typology works is when we do our survey and design we ascertain where all the homes in a deployment area are and we set a design threshold as to how far we can go. That has to take into account a number of things, namely the broadband speed we are providing today, the broadband speed we need to ensure we can provide over the next 30 to 40 years and then account for new homes that are going to be added in over that period in terms of the utilisation and capacity for those homes. There are a number of areas. It does get technical but it comes down to what we call the propagation loss of the light that travels down the cable. There is a certain limitation which we cannot go beyond. We have to stop somewhere. It might feel that where we stop the network is only 100 m or a kilometre away from somebody else, but members can rest assured that no home will be left behind. It may just be that they have to be served from another deployment area because of those limitations. It is not that we are choosing to take the easier homes or to move homes around. They are literally down to technical challenges. We need to ensure that we can deliver the speed, latency and availability over the contract period, which is 25 years but, equally, to meet the ten-year extension to which we have committed with the Department.

Mr. Peter Hendrick:

When we started deploying the network we made a decision to go with the latest, best technology, which was called XGS-PON. That technology will deliver 10 Gbps to the home. Every white box that we install in the home today supports 10 GB of connectivity. In order to upgrade that, the next variant of that will be 25 GB, 40 GB and then 100 GB. We are dependent on the equipment vendors in the market that are developing this technology but the standards have been set and as networks require the demand for that bandwidth the equipment vendors produce the technology. The key point of our technical solution was the type of lasers we install in the equipment. In designing the network we made sure that the lasers that we installed were a certain class. Each laser has a different type of class. Basically, by the class we chose, we will be able to meet the speeds of 25 GB, 40 GB, and 100 GB to the home into the future based on the way we have designed the network in the technology evolution of XGS-PON, which is the foundation of the technology we use.

We have designed the network to ensure that we can deliver that. Typically, that is up to 25 km away from where our head-end location is - homes that are within 25 km of the cable route. We have got to remember that as the cable goes out to all the homes there are patch points and additional connections coming in. Every time we have one of those patch points in connections we have a loss on the cable so we have to calculate all of that in. Depending on how many homes are in an area, it might go from 25 km down to 19 km. It just depends on how many connections come onto the network at that point in time. In addition to the optical network we also have sufficient spare capacity in the network for any new homes connecting to the network over the full life of the contract.

Eugene Murphy (Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

No, I am not happy but there is probably not much that can be done. The Chair knows how frustrating it is to people who are a couple of hundred metres away from a network. There are a lot of houses grouped together and they cannot understand how it is down the road and it is going to take three or four years to get to them. Anyway, that is just the way it is.

Mark Wall (Labour)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

I apologise to the witnesses as I got parked on the N7 on the way in, as did a lot of people this morning.

Mark Wall (Labour)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

Yes, in fairness, we are working on that. A lot of people were caught on the N7 today.

I thank the witnesses. I am benefiting from fibre broadband in my area, as are my neighbours. It has made a difference. It is important to start off with that.

I apologise if my questions have been asked previously. There are pockets in the area where fibre has been delivered where for whatever reason some of my neighbours and constituents are finding it very difficult to get through and to get answers on. Is there a special email address? I know we have one but, unfortunately, I have not been able to get an answer on that as well for those people. I know some of them have been asking questions for a couple of months. I would appreciate if we got a reply.

My second question is as important. I raised this issue the previous time we met the witnesses. It relates to community groups and rural hubs.

I am specifically talking about my own area where we have recently converted an old school. Is there a process under which we can apply to have fibre broadband to allow some neighbours who may not wish to get caught up on the N7 to work from home or from a community hub? I compliment the broadband officers and the council. Are there plans to expand that scheme or where exactly are the broadband officers operating at the moment?

Mark Wall (Labour)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

To clarify, what is happening here is that there are some additional works needed in order to provide for these people whose neighbours are getting fibre broadband. They have been told these works will be provided. This is going on for a number of months and unfortunately we have not been able to get to the bottom of it. Their neighbours are getting fibre broadband, but because of additional works, these people cannot get it and they are finding it very difficult to get answers as to how long it is going to take.

Mr. Peter Hendrick:

We have tried to be very open and transparent with communications around the deployment timelines but equally with homes getting connected to the network. If somebody is moved or is in a different deployment area, we will be able to answer that through our call centre or through the reps, as Ms Collins described earlier. I would be happy to take any of those specific requirements and requests and we will follow up on them for the Senator. If it is related to a connection, or if somebody who has placed an order is having challenges in getting connected, sometimes there are issues in connecting homes to the network. When we arrive out to do a connection, a number of issues can arise. We may have thought there was a duct already in place from where we have our equipment, whether that is when we are going overhead to underground or going underground from a chamber. We may have thought there was an existing duct and there may be no duct. It might be an existing direct-buried copper cable, which means we have to open up the road and get road-opening licences. Sometimes we need to apply for standing new poles to connect homes. Sometimes the route we had originally designed for the connection is not available. We may realise we are coming across somebody else's land and that wayleave or right to cross is not forthcoming, and we have to think about redesigns and redeployment of infrastructure.

I will give some sense of how we have approached this under the NBP versus how a commercial operator would have approached it. In our survey and design, we capture as much information as we can in the beginning of the programme, and as we go through the programmes, on all of the connections. We are looking at what existing infrastructure is provided to those homes in terms of a copper cable. If the copper cable is an old telephone line, we need to establish if it is underground. We look at the chamber and see if it looks like there is a lead-in duct going to the home. At that stage, we cannot try to rod and rope to see if every one of those ducts goes all the way to the home and is not blocked. That is one scenario. We know we are going underground; we just do not know what remediation works might need to be done. If it is overhead, it is somewhat easier because we are already on the pole network and we know we can go from the pole to the home. However, if we are transiting across somebody else's land, even if they have previously supported it with a copper network but they are not proposing to support it with the NBP fibre network, we may have to do redesign, redeployment and rebuild infrastructure. Looking at this for the 60,000 homes we have connected, because we have done the survey and design work upfront, our success rate in being able to connect is quite high on this programme compared to other commercial operators. What we see today is that approximately 5% of homes can take greater than 60 days to get connected because of some of these challenges. We are continuously working, based on the experience we have had, to try to improve on that. Given the types of scenarios with which we have had issues when connecting homes, we use the data we have to apply the right resources. We may need to apply more surveying resources at the time of connection because we have seen a similar scenario before, or we may need heavy civil crews. Ultimately, we still have to go back to the local authorities when we want to apply for road opening licences, traffic management for closing roads, and tree trimming for running cables for connections. We need to make sure we manage a number of parts closely with the local authorities, our end contractor and the end user. Ms Collins may want to come in on some of communications with end users.

Ms Tara Collins:

Yes. I gather the Senator is talking about the end users who have placed orders and where there is a delay or they are waiting. We have a customer communications journey that has been designed between ourselves, our connects partner and our retail service providers, insofar as the end user gets regular text messages and communications from our operations call centre letting them know what stage they are at and what the issues are. We also have a huge amount of information online. We have worked closely with our retail service providers to ensure this information is available, for example, if a connection requires poles; if damaged poles need to be replaced; if new ducting is required for underground cables; if repairs, licensing applications or approvals are needed; or if trees need to be trimmed. We have been working really hard to improve on those communications. We have a customer communications journey and we are doing our best to communicate the issues on the ground in real time. In saying that, we appreciate that some customers are waiting longer than we would like and we are trying to keep them as up to date as possible.

Mr. Peter Hendrick:

Perhaps, I will just answer that question first on the order from May to August. What happens is that 90 days before we release a deployment area for order, we allow a preorder window. All of our communications are around the preorder window and we set the live date. We will look into whether it is not being communicated to the end user. Certainly, when we communicate that there is a preorder window, the live date will not be until, for example, August. We set those dates and we communicate regularly and equally with the retail operators on that. We will check, look into that and come back to the committee on that.

On the communications from the connections contractor, we have worked with our contractor in detail about how their engineers are brought on board, how they are trained, what they say and how they manage that communication. It is something that we continuously manage with them and something we will take up with them. They should not be redirecting end users back to county councillors.

On KPIs, we have performance metrics that we aim to achieve and ultimately we have to achieve under the contract. One of them is to achieve 80% of connections within ten working days. As we ramped up, we were struggling to hit that 80% threshold within ten working days and we were certainly longer than that. Right now, we are at or about the 80% threshold within ten working days. Critical to that is the survey work we do upfront in understanding what type of connections they are. We are never going to capture every single scenario of what may go wrong with connections. There are always going to be issues. Typically, as the committee will understand, we have 165 crews with our connections contractor who are connecting homes single day and they ultimately do multiple connections. There are also associated plant and machinery with those crews, what we call civil crews, who are digging up roads. At times we have 25 or 26 of those digging and repairing infrastructure. We also have poling crews who are replacing and installing new poles. From a cost and efficiency perspective, we want to ensure that those resources are deployed on the right types of installs at the right time and that is really the purpose and design activity was upfront. We have teams who will move when needed to support some of the challenges in the network but there are always going to be scenarios where one has more than one problem with the connection.

We are trying to be very efficient in working with KN Network Services (IRE) Limited at the moment is that KN does not find one problem and leave site and send a team back to fix that one problem. When the teams to finish the cable come back again, they can find another problem. We are trying to see if we can ensure that if they find any problem that is going to happen on the install, whether that is on the side of the road or on the homeowner's land, they are looking at a full solution. Sometimes the installing engineer is not the engineer who is considering what is needed here and are they actually looking at the survey with regard to having four blockages where they need a road opening licence, traffic management, to stand a pole or to talk to the landowner about the new surface of their driveway or their grass verge. In scenarios like that we deploy surveyors to re-evaluate and redesign as opposed to engineers being back and forth with multiple problems. We believe that we are getting better, we believe that KN is improving and we believe that we will see greater improvement on this as we go forward.

Mr. Peter Hendrick:

I totally understand that.

Mr. Peter Hendrick:

I can come back to the Chair on that. The last record I remember seeing was 79% or maybe just over 80% but I can come back to the Chair on that.

Mr. Peter Hendrick:

No one is left behind. Some connections have taken longer and that is not our intent or desire. We want to get everybody connected and that is our imperative. We have percentages that we have targets to achieve against and that we rely on KN to perform against. There is a ten-day target, a 20-day target, a 45-day target and a 60-day target. We are managing KN as our connections contractor to deliver on those target deadlines.

Mr. Peter Hendrick:

Yes.

Mr. Peter Hendrick:

We will.

Mark Wall (Labour)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

Yes, I appreciate that.

Mr. Fintan O'Brien:

I thank the Chair and the Senator. There are two questions on our side. The first one related to a converted old school linked to the work of a community group and what funding might be available. There are a couple of possible funding streams that we have in place at the moment. For example, funding can be provided under the scheme such as the town and village renewal or the rural regeneration and development fund, depending on what sort of project one is looking at. We fund a number of projects with regard to the use of buildings and many of them are developing digital services.

One of the things we are working on at the moment is our calendar for the 2024 schemes. This is about getting the timing for them correct. We release that then at the start of next year to ensure that everybody is aware of all of the different funding opportunities available for community groups. By and large, such schemes are delivered through local authorities and there is a requirement for local authorities to directly engage with community groups o the development of projects which might have potential.

If one is looking at something more focused on, for example, making a broadband connection point in a building, that process is actually closed at the moment but we have the possibility of substituting out a BCP for a new BCP. That is very much done in consultation with the local authorities.

On the role of the broadband officers, which is a key role for us, we have done some work on that recently and we spend a good deal of time keeping in communication with the broadband officers. I might just hand over to my colleague, Mr. Whelan, to give the most recent update on that.

Mr. Brendan Whelan:

The Department co-funds the role of the broadband officer in each of the 31 local authorities. They tend to be the single point of contact for citizens, public representatives such as the committee members and telecoms operators who are trying to get work done. We provide the funding and require certain conditions to be met for that. They must be full time in the role, they must meet the requirements set out in the role profile and so forth. At this moment, we have responses from the local authorities that 22 of these officers are confirmed and that they have them in place. That is not to say that the other officers are not there; it is just that those local authorities have not come back to us to confirm it with regard to the funding at this point. We are pursuing them to follow up on that to see exactly where they are. A few of the local authorities are carrying vacancies for some time but the vast bulk of local authorities have a broadband officer in place.

Mr. Brendan Whelan:

That is exactly where we are.

Mr. Peter Hendrick:

Mr. Malone may correct me if I am wrong. Typically, it can take anything up to 30 days to get specific licences approved but, in general, the programme and the engagement with local authorities have been quite good. I would not say there has been an issue with the local authorities around connections. There is a time within which we have to submit the licence and a time within which the licence comes back and is approved and the contractor commences work and mobilises a team.

Mr. T.J. Malone:

In fairness, the local authorities, in general, are working really well with us. It took us a while to get them all on board and get used to this. I will not go into specific details as to what counties they are in, but there are still one or two local authorities that are slightly problematic. In general, however, they are working very well with us. It probably took us a while to get used to their systems and vice versaas regards the amount we were putting in. In fairness to the Department, it has put extra funding towards that and making sure they had the facilities within the local authorities. In general, it is less than 14 days, and in some cases they are turning around licences within a week. Part of the problem, as Members can imagine, is when we go out on site to do a connection. It is only at that point that we realise we need a road opening licence for that particular area, whereas on the build we will take a section of the build and apply for a T1 and T2 licence months in advance for that particular section. We could be allowed to excavate maybe up to a hundred blockages in that particular section under that licence, which we would have applied for in advance, but, in fairness, on the connections, we do not realise that until we actually get to the door of the house.

Mr. Hendrick spoke about the survey and design we do, which is unique. No other commercial operator will survey and design every premises for a connection, which we do at the point of the regional survey. It throws up only so much. We cannot go in and rod ducts the whole way through and understand exactly what it is. It is a matter of the time that takes. While the local authority might turn it around reasonably quickly, we have to take that back from site, prepare the application, submit the application, get that back and then put that back into the system to go back out. We are getting better at it all the time, but it is a process that needs a bit more defining now. It would be ideal if we did not have to apply for that road opening licence and could proceed straight away, maybe under a T3-type licence, an emergency-type licence, whereby we could potentially continue to excavate and then retrospectively put it in as a licence. Maybe that would help in the future. As it stands, however, for the system that is in place, the local authorities are, in general, working very well with us.

Mr. Fergal Mulligan:

A Chathaoirligh, if you do not mind, we will take that. My colleague, Mr. O'Donoghue, who deals with the local authorities, will answer it.

Mr. Kevin O'Donoghue:

We did start looking at an engagement with the local authority sector because of the difficulties that were there at the start. We secured funding of €6 million from the Government. We have offered it to the local authority system, €2 million a year for three years. Each of them has come back. We are one year into it. We are starting to look at the outcomes from it. We will work with the Road Management Office, RMO, as well as part of that to ensure we are working with the shared service with responsibility for it.

As Mr. Malone pointed out, however, the length of time for decisions has dropped dramatically as a result of the fact that we have requested specific directors of services to take responsibility in each local authority for the engagement with the broadband roll-out. It is up to them then how they spend the money, but it is to be done for the determination of licences and for the engagement they need to have.

We have also started a series of regional engagements with the local authorities. We do two in each region each year. I was in Kerry in September with a colleague of mine. Mr. Mulligan was with us for that engagement. We were in Sligo the week before last. We will be in Longford on 23 November. We bring the local authorities together in order that they can discuss with one another any of the difficulties they are having and how other local authorities are resolving them. As regards specific queries that come up where NBI is having some difficulty, it contacts us. It has a specific person who engages with the local authorities. We meet that person regularly. If there is a specific query causing concern, we will step in as a Department and get involved and see what we can do to resolve the query. In some instances the queries the local authority has are perfectly valid. In some instances it is just a matter of finding the right person within the local authority to sign off the particular issue. In general, the engagement with the local authority sector has become an awful lot better. On a semi-regular basis, we go to the climate action, transport, circular economy and networks, CATCEN, committee and update the local authority sector at County and City Management Association, CCMA, level generally as to where we are with them. We have much better contacts with the right people in each local authority. The broadband officers also come along to those regional meetings. We are trying to ensure that the provision of information to the system and within the system where they are talking to one another is able to resolve the queries.

Mr. Kevin O'Donoghue:

It depends on what the specific query is. As Mr. Mulligan pointed out earlier, one of the ones we were looking at recently was the bridge in Valentia, which is a swing bridge. How do we engage with the local authority to allow the cable to go across the bridge but in such a way that the bridge can open in the event that the local authority needs to do that? That is a slower process. It is a different engagement. It is a specific issue. There are one or two of them that crop up for special areas of conservation or if they are archaeological sites of interest that they want us to get involved with to look at the map overlays. Maybe we have to move some of the design or whatever else, but they are very limited specific instances where that is happening at the moment.

Mr. Fergal Mulligan:

To be fair, and I think we will come back to Mr. Malone, we are not aware of any particular local authority that is an outlier. There may have been one a year or two ago. We will have to come back to NBI on that, as opposed to the unique issues Mr. O'Donoghue identified. I think it might be unfair to say there are two or three outliers.

Mr. Fergal Mulligan:

Absolutely.

Mr. Fergal Mulligan:

Exactly. To be fair, I have been at a lot of these meetings, and the local authorities are knocking it out of the park on the licensing compared with where they were. I think NBI has acknowledged that that is happening. Licences which were taking three to four months to do are now being done in days. To be fair to broadband officers, the planning departments and the road opening licence departments and engineers, there is a collective group in every local authority and they are working extremely hard. As I said, I think the evidence we have in all the tables I am seeing is that it is going extremely well. That needs to be acknowledged as well.

Mark Wall (Labour)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

The Cathaoirleach has summed them up well. My concerns were about broadband officers and local authorities, so I thank him.

I will ask a follow-up question about BCPs. It was mentioned that they could be substituted, but is there a process for that? The local community I have in mind availed of rural funding, which was appreciated, but how would we go about substituting one BCP for another?

Mr. Brendan Whelan:

It is mainly done through the local authority. The local authority would need to identify a particular BCP that was coming out of the system, as it were, for the other BCP to be swapped in. We have done it in a number of areas, but it would depend on a point in the Kildare area dropping out of the BCP programme and being moved to somewhere else. It would be done through the local authority.

Mark Wall (Labour)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

As always. I appreciate the answers.

Éamon Ó Cuív (Galway West, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

Last week, I received an email from someone running a substantial business on an offshore island about how the Department of Rural and Community Development had committed to delivering high-speed BCPs in digital hubs and schools on the islands. The person wrote that, tús áite do connection points, digital hubs and schools, breathnaíonn sé nach bhfuil aon phráinn le monarcha nó do ghnóthaí beaga ar na hoileáin. That is a fair point. This person is paying an astronomical amount – more than €7,000 per year – for broadband. Whether it comes from NBI or the Department, it would be useful if we could get an update on when the islands will be connected, particularly the major offshore ones. The list might specify whether the connections will be fibre or point-to-point. What number of premises on each island are covered by the survey? I understand the roll-out system and that the easy premises have been done, not because NBI wanted to take the easy pickings, but because doing so has allowed the roll-out to happen. What NBI will find out is that half the islands’ population are on the three Aran Islands, but there are also people on Clare Island, Inishturk, Inishbofin, Tory Island, Arranmore and Bere Island. I am not counting Achill as an island for the purposes of the exercise.

My question for the Department is wider than just broadband. Does the Department not have a dedicated islands fund? There is a subheading for oileáin in its Estimates.

Mr. Fintan O'Brien:

Island capital funding is available.

Éamon Ó Cuív (Galway West, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

The situation does not seem to be quite how I understood it. I believed that that funding could be used for any infrastructural shortfall in, for example, piers, roads, coastal erosion, health, education, power, communications, recreation or community. It could be obtained in all sorts of creative ways, for example, co-funding, solitary funding, part funding, total funding or with the Department as the main funder, other than the community. Does the Department track what projects would have needed to wait much longer in the queue due to cost-benefit analyses by the various providers if we did not have an island fund that could be used in so many creative ways to push projects forward and make them attractive? Previously, 50% funding was provided for health centres, which made it attractive for the HSE to move to somewhere. A cost-benefit analysis would usually decide between an island with 300 people and an urban area of 3,000 people, but when money suddenly appears on the table, providers want to do things. I can understand that. That was the whole idea of the fund. Since the piers are not fishing piers, the Department of Agriculture, Food and the Marine is not interested, so they are effectively 100% funded by the Department of Rural and Community Development. There was a similar arrangement in respect of electricity, where the Department handled the point-to-point work, the networks and so forth for ESB Networks, commonly called the ESB. Is the Department’s islands division looking at all aspects of island infrastructure and asking how to move projects up the back list by using its money pot instead of leaving them low down on the list due to being awkward to get to? Is such a proactive approach being taken or do the agencies just do what they want and the islands must take their turn?

My final question is very much directed to the Department of the Environment, Climate and Communications. It is a simple question. If I set off from Clonbur in my area towards Finny and go to Tonlegee or Glentraigue, there is no mobile signal. If I go into the Inagh Valley, which some of the witnesses will have heard of, or go around the Kylemore area – not just the abbey section of it, as Kylemore starts way before that turn – or Inishbofin, mobile signal is very poor. You can be quite deep inside a valley and be nowhere near a mobile signal. What progress has the task force made in taking in what should have been part of the contract from the very beginning – we sold the thing for a bit of extra money and sold 5% of the population short – in the past four or five years and what progress is planned to be made to cover these black spots? The map shows the situation. The witnesses all know the famous map. They can see the mountainous areas in Wicklow, Connemara and Donegal – the Cathaoirleach is lucky in Roscommon, as there are not too many mountains in east Galway – and that they still do not have mobile coverage.

Mr. Fergal Mulligan:

I will address the Deputy’s questions on the islands and then pass over to my colleague. Owing to a delay of eight and a half months due to Covid, we went back to NBI at the start of the year to see what we could do to get the islands done faster. I am glad to say that we have come to an arrangement under which NBI has brought forward many of them. My colleague, Mr. Brown, will provide a rundown of the seven islands we have brought forward. There are 27 islands. Mr. Brown can give a rundown of exactly what is being served by a point-to-point connection and what is being served by fibre. The majority are served by point-to-point connections with the mainland. That has been the result of the exercise. We have specific timelines for when those people can order broadband. I will let Mr. Brown run the Deputy through those. We only agreed and contractualised the arrangement with NBI in the past month or two. We will now roll out a programme to tell the islanders the dates on which the service will be ready. To address the Deputy’s previous point, is it 2025-----

Éamon Ó Cuív (Galway West, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

If Mr. Mulligan gave the information to us tomorrow, we would make sure the islanders knew. He need not worry about that.

Mr. Fergal Mulligan:

The Deputy will have it today. I will give it to him now. Regarding 2025 and 2026, giving anyone a timeframe of 12 months is not appropriate.

That does not give a great sense of confidence to anybody that it will happen any time soon. There is continued engagement between us and NBI to improve the website. It was until now 2025 and 2026; the latest development is that there is more information on 2025 and 2026, divided into quarters. That is a continuing process and, as Ms Collins said, the more information from the build company, which is Mr. Malone’s company, the more information goes on the website. Hopefully, this time next year, everybody will know to within a quarter when they will get a service. We are not far from everybody knowing and getting away from the 12-month or two-year window. Mr. Brown will give a rundown on the islands, the 27 of them.

Mr. Gavin Brown:

As Mr. Mulligan said, at the end of 2022 and into 2023 NBI and ourselves undertook a full review of the deployment plan and technical solution for all remaining islands. The output is a confirmed plan for all islands. Of the seven Mr. Mulligan mentioned, a number were in 2027 and have been brought forward by a number of months. Inis Meáin, Inis Mór and Inis Oírr were originally forecast to be ready for service in June and August 2027, respectively. All three islands will now be ready in June 2026, an improvement of between 12 and 14 months. Of the other islands we looked at, Sherkin and Cape Clear were forecast for April 2026 and are now planned for March 2025, an acceleration of circa 13 months. Valentia Island was in the current plan for 2027 and has now been brought forward by 14 months to the end of 2025. It is not a huge improvement but we have improved Achill Island by two to three months: it was September 2025 and is now June 2025. There are a number of other islands, if the Deputy would like me to go through them.

Éamon Ó Cuív (Galway West, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

Keep going with the big ones.

Éamon Ó Cuív (Galway West, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

They tend to be the same thing.

Mr. Gavin Brown:

Bere Island is planned to be ready for service in quarter 4 of 2025; Dursey Island, quarter 3 of 2025; Horse Island, quarter 3 of 2026; Tory Island, which was referenced earlier, quarter 2 of 2025; Owey Island, quarter 2 of 2025; Arranmore, quarter 3 of 2025; Inishbofin, quarter 3 of 2025.

Éamon Ó Cuív (Galway West, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

There are two Inishbofins, in Donegal and Galway.

Mr. Gavin Brown:

The one in Galway is quarter 3 of 2025. To confirm, the three Aran Islands are June 2026. Valentia, which we have discussed, is quarter 4 of 2025; Achillbeg in Mayo is quarter 3 of 2025; Inishbiggle is quarter 3 of 2025; and Clare Island off Mayo is quarter 3 of 2025. I am not sure if I have missed anything there.

Éamon Ó Cuív (Galway West, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

There was a lot there.

Éamon Ó Cuív (Galway West, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

If we could get those, it would be really useful.

Mr. Fintan O'Brien:

To reiterate my original point, what the islands policy commits to in terms of Government policy is the roll-out of the NBP. Colleagues have given an update on the expediting of some dates and moving them forward as quickly as possible, which is important.

On the Department’s approach to capital funding for islands, the Deputy will be well aware there are a number of major capital projects under the NDP relating to piers in Inis Oírr, Inis Meáin and Donegal. There are minor capital works delivered on a co-funding basis with local authorities. There is a degree of flexibility in that. It is not a scheme I run, but I understand funding for it was of the order of €4.1 million in 2022.

More widely, we are trying with capital funding on islands, while there is dedicated funding, to ensure there is a wider package of supports for islands. While we are focusing on broadband today, a couple of things are happening that are relevant to ring-fencing priority for islands in things like the local improvement scheme, CLÁR and town and village renewal. We see them as a package with connectivity, broadband, piers, minor capital works and so on. We are trying to develop that at the moment. There has been prioritisation within the roll-out of the NBP, which the island’s policy commits to, and then there is what we are doing with our capital funding as well. I am not sure if that answers the question.

Éamon Ó Cuív (Galway West, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

Will Mr. O'Brien clarify? It was my suspicion that there has been a massive change in policy and instead of all infrastructure, including social, educational, recreational communications and energy, as well as local authority infrastructure, being in the mix, the Department is now more or less confining itself to piers, roads, village renewal, LIS, which is roads but non-county roads, etc. That is about as far as the Department is going in looking at infrastructure deficits and making sure a school or whatever happens

Mr. Fintan O'Brien:

It is not my side of the Department. That said, we are trying to create a wider package. I do not think we have said explicitly we are limiting ourselves to anything. With all these capital funds, there has to be flexibility as the need arises. There is prioritisation and flexibility. There is nothing to say, in my understanding of it, that we are limiting ourselves for where we go with the policy and capital investment over a number of years.

Éamon Ó Cuív (Galway West, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

The specific issue is whether the Department is looking at the gamut of capital public infrastructure and making sure the islands are on a par with the mainland.

Mr. Fergal O'Brien:

That is no problem.

Éamon Ó Cuív (Galway West, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

It would be useful to get clarity because there was very little clarity in the islands policy, for all the pages in it, on that issue.

Mr. Fintan O'Brien:

We will follow that up.

Éamon Ó Cuív (Galway West, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

We-----

Éamon Ó Cuív (Galway West, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

We did not get any great clarity on the mobile roll-out.

Mr. Fergal Mulligan:

Mobile would not be my area but my understanding of what ComReg has done with the licensing is it has issued the licence to get 5G coverage to 95% of the population. Population coverage does not cover national parks and the lovely parts of Roscommon and Wicklow where the Cathaoirleach and I live.

Mr. Fergal Mulligan:

The black spots mentioned, if they are in a national park, will take time to get addressed by 5G. Remote rural areas that may be behind a hill or around mountains are very difficult to get to. We will not have a plethora of towers and masts all over the place. In fairness to the mobile companies, it is difficult infrastructure to build to get to unique, one-off housing, if that is the main issue. The new 5G licences have different criteria around them to deal with motorways and national roads and make sure coverage is on those, which did not apply under previous licensing arrangements in 4G and 3G.

There have been a number of improvements under the new licensing arrangements, which were issued by ComReg only earlier this year. These are being rolled out only now by the three main companies, Vodafone, Eir and Three. As I said in my opening statement, we have got to 70% and we are getting towards 80% and 90%. They have not got there yet but that will happen over the next few years.

The target is 2030 by which to get to all populated areas with 5G. AsMr. Hendrick noted, the roll-out of the NBP is going to help with coverage because, under the NBP, as we are bringing fibre throughout these rural roads, mobile companies can go to NBI and seek coverage for fibre to towers and masts on the hills and mountains to improve the coverage and capacity as they roll out their equipment. It is organically getting better and will get better over the coming years. Through the commercial roll-out and the new licensing arrangements ComReg has put in place, it is incrementally improving this year, next year and the year after that, although there are still problems as of today.

Éamon Ó Cuív (Galway West, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

What does the Department define as a populated area? I deal with plenty of populated areas that do not have mobile phone service, and I am not talking about just one house in a massive valley.

Mr. Fergal Mulligan:

On the 3G switch-off, my understanding is that is with Vodafone at the moment in the main and it is running a pilot programme in Limerick. ComReg will oversee that transition away from 3G to ensure end users will not be negatively impacted. That will be an orderly transition away from 3G, with minimal impact on end users, as I understand.

We will revert to the committee with a note on 4G. Again, the licence conditions were set by ComReg and are currently in a period of being complied with over the next couple of years. They are not at full coverage where they are. I understand they do, at a minimum, cover all villages, for example, in terms of when they get the full roll-out. Populated areas are, therefore, at least villages.

Éamon Ó Cuív (Galway West, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

Yes, but 30% do not live in villages-----

Mr. Fergal Mulligan:

ComReg and the industry will be better placed to answer those questions.

Mr. Peter Hendrick:

I will come back to the Cathaoirleach on that.

Éamon Ó Cuív (Galway West, Fianna Fail)
Link to this: Individually | In context | Oireachtas source

When the power goes off in my area I lose all mobile signal so all that is left is the house landline to contact the outside world. Somebody said to me the other night that they have a serious significant illness and they understand that if the copper is gotten rid of that the fibre needs an electricity supply so, therefore, without power one is completely cut off. I suggest that the Chairman adds that issue to his questions on copper cables.

Mr. Fergal Mulligan:

Regarding the European position on gigabit broadband, they have updated state aid guidelines. The ones we worked on previously, under our intervention, was the 2013 state aid guidelines. The guidelines were updated in 2021 and the minimum thresholds were significantly increased to a target of 1 gigabit for everybody. The Digital Decade target from Europe has set everything at a minimum speed of 1 gigabit by 2030 and the state aid guidelines reflect that by giving a mandate to member states to intervene where that speed will not be achieved. The 2013 threshold of 30 megabit no longer exists for new interventions but still applies to our state aid decision because it was based on the 2013 guidelines.

However, from an Ireland perspective it is no longer relevant because, for blue areas, we are being assured by all the commercial companies that all of those premises will get gigabit broadband, with Eir being the main company saying it will deliver gigabit broadband to all blue areas.

Mr. Fergal Mulligan:

Eir is saying by 2028, actually. It is saying 1.9 million premises will be supplied by not later than, it hopes, 2026 or 2027. It has a roll-out plan. It is at nearly 1.2 million as we speak. Obviously, we are doing the rest with 600,000 with NBI, so 100% of Irish firms will get gigabit. The 30 megabit is no longer relevant. It was relevant for a threshold to come up with a blue and amber map. The term used now is very high capacity networks. That is the term used in the digital decade and in the new state aid guidelines.

Also there is a new Act going through the commission at the moment. It is in its fourth iteration and is called the Gigabit Infrastructure Act. The Act addresses a number of the questions about public infrastructure, mobile and fixed. I will be talking about it later at and presenting on it to the mobile broadband task force after lunch. It is very significant regulation that has been brought in to replace the broadband cost reduction directive. It will be in place, we expect, through the Spanish Presidency, and in law by next March. Every member state in Europe has 24 months to comply with it. That law requires the member states to have a single information point, or information points, which set out on an electronic database every piece of public and private infrastructure, be that a tower, a mast, a piece of ducting, a pole or whatever can be used to put fibre cable or 5G equipment on. All that has to be on a database within 24 months in order that anyone building networks, including the companies such as those in County Roscommon, can say they want to use that infrastructure and there will be a paper on the website with the terms conditions and prices to access it. That will be a mandated regulation that will be in law by March and has to be implemented by every member state.

Mr. Fergal Mulligan:

The key message to the mobile broadband task force from the Minister today, and from myself, will be that we need to get on with the implementation of this Act as soon as possible across all 31 local authorities. We will be conscious of the fact that many roll-outs and huge investment are going on. The purpose of this Act is to avoid duplication of infrastructure. We do not want NBI, Eir, SIRO or Virgin Media to dig up roads where they should not. We will not be waiting for 24 months. We are actually starting today to roll that out. That addresses the point that Europe and Ireland have moved on well beyond 30 megabits.

Mr. Fergal Mulligan:

The point is they are not waiting until 2028. The last will be done by 2028. Eir at the moment is rolling it out to 1.2 million premises, and NBI says it is rolling out 8,000 to 10,000 a month. We understand Eir is doing at least 10,000 a month, so that makes 120,000 people a year who are not waiting. There will be 120,000 done next year and the year after that who are in the blue to amber area if they are not being covered by NBI. Those villages are being done. They will be done this year, next year and the year after by Eir, SIRO and Virgin Media. There is a great deal going on, so between the three companies, 10,000 by NBI, and the other three companies, we are looking at between 40,000 and 50,000 premises per month that are being passed with gigabit fibre. That is unbelievable.

Mr. Fergal Mulligan:

At the moment, there is a 33% year-on-year increase in subscriptions. At the moment these guys are doing 3,500 a month. We understand between Eir and SIRO, there are 8,000 done a month. That is 12,000 a month getting connected with fibre. Fibre is now the dominant connection technology. It has surpassed cable, surpassed mediacell and every other technology. As of today, about 620,000 people are connected to fibre. In 2017, that figure was about 20,000. It is a phenomenal change.

To come back to the national school in County Roscommon, I am surprised a blue area is still there and we have not been told about it. I am taking that on today because we have changed thousands of premises that were blue into amber, as members know, so we will get to that straight away. If there is fibre on either side of it, that should be sorted very quickly. In fairness to Mr. Hendrick, he cannot address that, because if it is blue, it is not his problem. I will try to make it his problem next week, I promise.

Mr. Fergal Mulligan:

That seems like a communication gap. Why was it blue in the first place? There was misinformation. People told us it was connected and it was not. We will deal with that as soon as possible because we want every school done. The three that are left are just Mr. Hendrick's problem. He has promised me they will be done by the end of the year. I believe him.

Mr. Peter Hendrick:

Next week.

Mr. Fergal Mulligan:

That is in good hands. He has a fourth one now as I see it.

In regard to copper switch-off, I understand a decision has been made by ComReg on how that process should work for regulated products on Eir's network. One key distinction we need to make on copper switch-off is on copper removal. Eir has only proposed switching off the copper. There is no plan to remove it from any poles or from any ducting. That would be a concern to the Department. As part of the mobile broadband task force we will bring up over the next number of months the issue of what is the process to remove copper on poles. If as we understand, ComReg is to give a plan to Eir, because it has to do so, we do not believe there will be any copper switched off in the next two to three years. We do not know but that is the indication from ComReg. It could be 2026 before switch-off starts. It will be on a phased basis, area by area.

There is possibly a misconception that the removal of copper is going to be a windfall gain to whoever removes it. Copper is on these poles but it is a very small element of the cable and it is surrounded by a lot of steel protection. It will cost a lot of money to remove. Whether there is eventually a significant gain from removing it is yet to be seen and that again depends on the price of copper on any given day and spot markets and so forth. It is a very big project. One of the things we are going to look into with ComReg and through our own Department is how we actually get a communication process throughout the country so that people understand what this means. In the event that people are on copper and they need it for a cash machine, a pharmacy or indeed for medical devices in the home, we need to ensure the power does not go off. That is part of the ComReg job and it is part of the decision it published, that the consumer and the end user is not to be negatively impacted by the switching off or removal of copper and there is a seamless transition to the next available technology. Mary or Johnny Murphy should not see the difference. That is what the decision from ComReg says, as I understand it. On the cost differential, ComReg also said they should not see a cost, or certainly a cost that is overly burdensome, in that transition. That is what the decision says, as I understand it. That was published just a few weeks ago. It was notified to the European Commission and that is in place, as I understand it, in law.

The main point is that copper switch-off is a big project. Something akin to that was done a number of years ago, and that was analogue switch-off. Television was moved from analogue to digital, and as we all know that required a significant campaign. Even though only a couple of hundred thousand people were on analogue at the time, it was necessary to get them on to set-top boxes so that they saw no difficulty moving from analogue to digital. The same process and project will be required to go from copper to fibre because there will be hundreds of thousands people who may or may not want to go to fibre, for whatever reason, but who will be required to go onto fibre or an alternative technology because copper will not be available for voice and broadband beyond 2026 or 2027. However, between now and then, the project will be to get a communications process and project in place between the regulator, our Department, the industry and other stakeholders and consumer groups to make sure end users, in particular vulnerable people, are not negatively impacted by this project. That is all I can say on that.

In regard to USO, that is now enshrined in law. The legislation passed in the summer so we now have a universal service mandate for broadband and voice that was not there heretofore. Voice has been there for past 20 years. It has been replaced by the new code but now we have broadband. Part of the job in my Department now is to define what adequate broadband means for USO and what affordability means. We will be bringing forward proposals on that to the Government in the next 18 months. There will be public policy decisions.

Is adequate broadband 100 Mbps, 500 Mbps or 500 Gbps? Those are the big policy questions we are going to have to deal with, along with what affordability means for voice and broadband. It is now a universal service right for every citizen to have adequate broadband at an affordable price and that has been in law since June.

Ms Tara Collins:

I wanted to add to the points made on the question about schools. Obviously, we look forward to receiving the Deputy's local national school. The other three outstanding are Templemore, Lusk and Kells. The second two are scheduled for this Friday. Templemore is scheduled for next Tuesday, and then we are done.

Ms Tara Collins:

Yes.

Mr. Fintan O'Brien:

I will answer a few of the questions that were posed. We are well on the way to the target of onboarding 400 hubs over the lifetime of the policy. The process started with finding out where they were in the first place. That mapping process was not as easy as it might sound, to be quite honest. There is a huge benefit to it, however. I have seen that trying to locate a hub abroad can be very difficult compared with how simple it is here due to that mapping process. The WDC is managing a process for us in the context of that onboarding. Sometimes it can take a little bit longer than we might like, but there is an element of ensuring that coherence of quality and making sure that the requirements to be on the network are met. There may be some out there who have been invited who may have been somewhat reticent at the start and wanted to see proof of the concept working. We have managed to convince a lot more of them at this stage that this has been something of benefit to hub owners and should see an uptick in that. Elements of that also relate to the issue of raising awareness. We have been working with the WDC on a number of awareness-raising campaigns and the promotional vouchers so it is a priority for us to head towards that target as quickly as possible.

On the digital innovation projects, we do not have a commitment for this in our budget for next year other than to say on the islands' side that we have a commitment to roll out a detailed implementation plan, DIP, for islands next year. Having said that, we will be going into the start of the year with a review of the national broadband plan locations, so that will have an impact there.

Regarding the example given of the programme with Microsoft and the migrant workers, that is exactly what we are thinking at the moment for the future of the hubs and BCPs. We agree that there will be a requirement for the hubs and BCPs to be able to pivot to new challenges and opportunities. At the moment, we are putting that new strategy in place for the sustainable development of hubs and BCPs and part of that involves looking for new services, new cross-Government approaches, and looking for pilots that have worked elsewhere. As part of that process, that is certainly something that would interest us and we will be looking for those types of new services. One of things we are doing linked to that on the BCPs, is to provide a new platform for them so that when these services are rolling out, there is a better platform for booking payments, promotion, and creating that community. Certainly, that is something that is in line with our thinking on the future of the sector.