John O'Mahony (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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I ask all members to please switch off their mobile phones.

We are discussing the proposal that Dáil Éireann and Seanad Éireann approve the Electricity Regulation Act 1999 (Restricted Electrical Works Regulations) 2013, copies of which were laid before Dáil Éireann in draft form on 13 June 2013. The order has been circulated to members. It was referred to the committee by the Dáil and Seanad on Tuesday, 25 June 2013. Members have received briefing material prepared by the Department of Communications, Energy and Natural Resources. I welcome the Minister for Communications, Energy and Natural Resources, Deputy Pat Rabbitte, and his officials to the meeting. I invite the Minister to make his opening remarks.

Pat Rabbitte (Dublin South West, Labour)
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The business before us this morning is not as exciting as what is going on elsewhere, and I doubt it will trend on Twitter later today, but it is important nonetheless because the motion concerns electrical safety in the home. The Houses of the Oireachtas have conferred on the Commission for Energy Regulation a statutory function for electrical safety.

Michael Moynihan (Cork North West, Fianna Fail)
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This a commonsensical regulation. I was going to say it would not set the world alight. There have been accidents. All kinds of electrical work were done in the early days, but people are now conscious of the dangers of electricity. RECI and others have been serious about their business. This regulation must be welcomed and I have no difficulty with it.

The regulation deals predominantly with family homes and so forth, but a great deal of work that is not 100% kosher is done in businesses and on farms. In recent months, we have dealt with the CER in respect of safety and other issues. I thank it for its co-operation. Safety is paramount. In the past few days, I have seen incidents in homes and at workplaces that led to serious injuries. We cannot be too vigilant. I commend the regulation to the committee.

Dessie Ellis (Dublin North West, Sinn Fein)
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I welcome the regulation. I am a technician and am well used to dealing with electrical items. However, the regulation relates to domestic situations, but a broader range needs to be considered. There are rules for factories and other businesses, but some regulations of a similar nature would be useful in that respect.

Enforcing this regulation will be difficult. Inspectors have been used, but I do not know how they work. Will inspectors carry out checks or will it be just a case of producing the proper certification for the work when someone sells a house? I have often seen the shoddy and dangerous work done by people who do this work themselves. It has led to accidents, many of which I have witnessed over the years.

I welcome the setting of standards such as this one. I hope we can expand on it in respect of other areas.

John O'Mahony (Mayo, Fine Gael)
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I call Deputy Harrington and Senators Coghlan and Brennan, in that order.

Noel Harrington (Cork South West, Fine Gael)
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I welcome the motion and anything that will help to improve domestic safety. That most accidents occur in the home is an oft used cliche, but it is true. Electrical accidents are far too frequent. The fuse board works must be carried out only by registered electrical contractors, but by whom will they be certified? I presume the works will be certified by a different authority. Will the regulation go beyond that and insist that contractors be C2 registered? Will the Minister outline the penalties for non-compliance? Does the motion provide for retrospective actions in terms of cleaning up decades of bad practice in homes around the country?

Terry Brennan (Fine Gael)
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I stress the importance of proper wiring in homes in light of bogus electrical contractors extending electrical wiring in homes. The ESB will not connect a new home unless a RECI certification from a reputable electrical contractor is provided. Surely this will extend to the farmstead if the home owner is a farmer. Many electrical accidents occur in farmyards, perhaps because wiring was completed by people who were not qualified to do so.

Eamonn Maloney (Dublin South West, Labour)
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This measure is long overdue. I thank the Minister and his Department for taking this initiative. All of us as practising politicians will be familiar with the shortcuts taken during the building boom in terms of the construction not only of domestic homes, but other buildings. This applied not only in the area of electrics, but in the area of construction. One has only to look to the northside of this city to see some of the more prominent illustrations in this regard. I am sure members know what I am talking about.

This measure, while perhaps a little expensive, will assist in people being safer in their homes. We have had too many fires in domestic homes. I welcome the measure.

Pat Rabbitte (Dublin South West, Labour)
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I thank colleagues for their questions in regard to the scope of the regulation. It is restricted to domestic dwellings. It is particular in its focus. On the question from Deputy Moynihan and Senator Brennan in regard to the farmstead as distinct from the farmhouse, etc., this instrument will apply to the farm house. The farm is regarded as a place of work. Paragraph 4.3 of the statutory instrument states: "...for the purposes of the Act designated electrical works does not include...". Those works not included are electrical works on a construction site and so on. I would have thought that the Health and Safety Authority would cover most of the other areas and that this regulation is particular to the domestic dwelling.

The domestic dwelling is defined as somewhat extended beyond the domestic residence in the sense that if there is a business in the home that does not have resort to electricity, more than the normal usage in the home and so on, such as, for example, a surgery or consulting room, that is covered. Anything that requires industrial scale electricity would not come under the aegis of this particular regulation.

On who provides certification, the onus is on the owner of the domestic dwelling to get a certificate from RECI stating that he or she has complied and so on. As Deputy Ellis will be aware, there is an internal system within the trade association to ensure its members are up to standard. It carries out occasional audits and so on to ensure they are up to standard. On penalties, these include, on indictment, a fine not exceeding €15,000 or a term of imprisonment not exceeding three years, or both. On summary conviction, the fine cannot exceed €5,000. It seems to me well judged. As stated by Deputy Maloney, even if there is some expense attached to engaging a reputable contractor as distinct from a cowboy operator, in the interests of domestic safety and so on it is worth it.

The regulation is not retrospective. It applies from here on. It is hoped it will be law in a few weeks. I again thank colleagues for their comments and questions.

Noel Harrington (Cork South West, Fine Gael)
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Has the Minister or Department consulted with the insurance federation and, if not, do they intend to do so? I would submit that if this is going to lead to greater safety in the home the insurance federation should come on board in terms of reduced insurance premiums.

Pat Rabbitte (Dublin South West, Labour)
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I have had extensive consultation on this matter with all of the stakeholders. As Deputy Harrington knows, whether we have best practise and high standards and if any acknowledgement will be given for this by way of insurance premium will be determined by the market. It will not be up to the regulator, the Department or myself to say that if everything is brought up to par the insurance industry should provide a discount. The market should be able to deal with that. The comfort for the insurance sector is that best standards apply and the risk of fire damage originating because of defective work carried out on fuse boxes will be greatly mitigated.

Dessie Ellis (Dublin North West, Sinn Fein)
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Whatever about physical work undertaken on a fuse box in a house or otherwise, will interference through the use of electronic equipment, with electrical or other outputs, attract a fine? Magnets and other tools are often used to roll back meters. Is this a matter for Electric Ireland or will such interference be an offence under this regulation and attract penalties?

Pat Rabbitte (Dublin South West, Labour)
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First, I can confirm to Deputy Harrington that the insurance sector was consulted. It has taken a positive position. However, we will have to wait and see if, following this coming into law, this will be reflected in future premia.

As I understand it, this relates to the installation of electricity rather than interference of the type mentioned by Deputy Ellis.

Dessie Ellis (Dublin North West, Sinn Fein)
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I appreciate that. I was asking if Electric Ireland would be the port of call in relation to interference with meters and so on.

Pat Rabbitte (Dublin South West, Labour)
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Yes.

Terry Brennan (Fine Gael)
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I have not heard of people trying to by-pass their meters.

Dessie Ellis (Dublin North West, Sinn Fein)
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It is happening a fair bit these days.

Pat Rabbitte (Dublin South West, Labour)
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How is it done?

Dessie Ellis (Dublin North West, Sinn Fein)
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There are various ways of doing it. Where there is a will, there is a way.