Richard Bruton (Dublin Bay North, Fine Gael)

Yes. I absolutely agree with this statement from the building council that we cannot tackle the three environmental crises we are facing without transitioning to a more circular construction industry. What I am hearing from the CIF, however, is that, like the Kerryman, "I would not start from here." That seems to be the dilemma we are trying to reconcile here.

The first question I would be interested to hear an answer to is how far public procurement has embraced the principles the building council outlines: building for repurposing, choosing materials based on their lifetime impact, making sure that you can easily adapt and that you do not have mixed materials that are then very hard to recycle and so on. How far are we down the line? I hear the CIF say that if only the clients would specify this, it could do a lot more, but where is the public client in this? That is the first question that strikes me.

How far on are we in agreeing the sector targets? We understood that when the circular economy Act was passed, within six months of the activation of a certain section, we would have a strategy for the construction sector and food and so on. Two years on, we do not have those. I understand that consultation is under way, but what are the witnesses' views on what the reuse target should be, what the material usage reduction target should be and what the recycling target should be?

What should change on sites to make all of these things possible? From the discussion, it seems that this is very ad hoc. The CIF is going to the EPA for its consideration of things. There does not seem to be an overall strategy that says certain things need to happen in a defined period. That is my frustration.

We have 2 million homes already and they are underoccupied. There is more space per person in Ireland than in other countries. A lot of people like myself are rattling around in three, four or five-bedroom houses. Where are we with repurposing, renovating and switching from three-bedroom to one-bedroom units, as Ms Jammet has mentioned, as regards our existing stock? Is the council only talking about new modular homes than can be easily constructed like Lego or is there a pathway towards releasing some of that underoccupied stock and making it easier for people who want to rightsize? At the moment, it seems that it is way beyond people's capacity to anticipate such a change as a result of planning costs and so on. If repurposing that existing 2 million is the most circular thing we could do, where are we with innovation in that area?